Ej25d turbo questions.

[demarioii]

So I've got a pretty good idea of what I have to do here. But I'll layout what my goal is. I have a 1999 Ej25d mt. My buddy has a 02 wrx bugeye wagon that he just put a vf into. He's giving me all his stock parts minus the intake piping. So I have everything, td04, oil drain lines, top mount, stock dp.

My goal is to boost this engine safely. I just want a turbo for a little extra kick. I don't really care about power. Should be about 6 to 8 psi. From what I've gathered I'll need a piggy back ems (Greddy Emanage) stage 1 clutch plate, and manual boost controller? Besides the stock wrx turbo parts?

Does the wrx headers bolt up? If not I'll just go borla reps. No big deal.

Do I need the Sti yellow fuel injectors? I do plan to upgrade the fuel pump to a wrx one at the time even though it's been said to run fine.

Any tips? Colder plugs? 96 Ej25d head swap?

I also work with special thermal coatings for turbo diesel engines. We coat them to handle more hp. Heads and valves. So upon turboing my car I plan to coat everything I can. Headers, turbo, valves, heads. From what I've been told the heads can only handle around 80 hp non coated, and we're told they can handle around 250 done. We also do the thermal coatings on most nascars headers. So I'm talking 2000$ coatings at my disposal. So with that extra Info in mind where do you think I stand for this build.

[demarioii]

[Garrison]

Anothernord would a good build to check out for info.

As far as your build, you've got good baselines; allow me to clarify some stuff for you.

If you have plans for EM, you aren't limited as much by boost - because you can pull timing (which is the real killer)
The td04 is a smallish turbo for the ej25d, you're going to find the boost down low and it'll top out around 5k rpm, not ideal, but it will work.
The intercooler is going to be a complete PITA to fit into the engine bay, b/c the ej25d intake manifold is not designed to have an intercooler attached, so the TB is too "long" (anothernord has some pics of this in his build thread); my suggestion would be to get a 06-07 wrx, or 03-07 fxt intercooler, as they're much smaller and fit nicely.

the coating is a fine idea, but no, the wrx headers won't fit unless you notch your crossmemember which is a no-no for safety's sake. ALSO don't use the UEL headers, just stick with your stock headers and fabricate your own up-pipe. It's going to help spool, and they aren't nearly as prone to fracturing.

Finally, I dunno who told you hp figures for heads, but suffice to say those figures are mistaken. Just wrap/coat whatever you please, it can only help with keeping down temps.

Ask away if you have more questions, I do so love these "turbo my N/A" threads.

EDIT: Yes to colder plugs, Yes to bigger fuel pump, Yes to bigger injectors if you can!

[demarioii]

Okay thanks! I thought my stock headers won't clear one of the pipes and or turbo. And yes, I've read everything on his page. I don't use cruse and also have a cnc shop to cut my throttle body down like he did. If I see a intercooler around I will pick it up instead of cutting the firewall and such, but that's not a big deal to me at all. I know the em system is going to hurt the most money wise.

It's not ideal, but for now it'll be a good introduction into turboing and tuning my engine until I can afford to upgrade. Plus these parts are free, well.... In trade for painting. So it's a no brainer.

[demarioii]

Oh that is right, I'll need the turbo crossmember of a legacy. Now was that a jdm part or were you guys referring to a 05 and up one. No one stated a year. Just said the wrx was to wide.

Also a jdm clutch Res. Or just cut mine down.

[Garrison]

You can avoid a lot of these headaches with an fxt/06-07 wrx intercooler. You don't need to cut anything, just relocate some things (and if you read my thread, keep your cruise).
The crossmember is from the ej22t legacy, it was available here in the states; but you're going to have to do some searching to find one. Check nasioc, rs25, et al to find something (or scrap yards). Again, fabbing your own Up-pipe might be an easier route if you know a good welder.

One extra thing I'll recommend is the IACV from a ej22t, as the snorkel goes straight up and makes piping for the intake a LOT easier.

[demarioii]

Okay, I agree with the 06 07 intercooler after searching for some.
Now here's my question. I'll have the turbo and all the piping next week. What would I need in order to run it with the stock management system. From the few builds I've lurked on different sites I can run 5 to 6 psi on stock everything. That's fine with me. I understand how a turbo works, but where in line would I need to put the manual boost controller. Obviously one on the Wastegate Actuator of the turbo, and than anywhere on the changed side. What do you recommend as far as a mbc.

I am at a lost for understanding the crossmember and it's purpose and why I'd need that one and couldn't modify what I have safety. I weld and have all those tools at my disposal so that's not an issue.

Basically, I'd like to run stage one clutch, Emanage ultimate, 10psi, sti injectors in 2 months. But next week and up until I'd like to run the turbo on stock everything which seems very reasonable at 5 to 6 psi.

Basically I believe all I'd need to do that is, wrx fuel pump (not necessarily, but I'm swapping my gas tank so might as well), manual boost controller, 06-7 intercooler, td04 and piping, oil drain lines, and coolant lines. Am I missing something that I'd need to have it running fine until I drop a grand into the rest of the system to run it better?

[demarioii]

Just some links and pictures to give myself a place to start, plus anyone else can see what I'm going off of and if I'm missing anything



Ej25d, td04 turbo running 5-6psi stock everything. Running for over 4 years strong, turbo'd at 45k miles though.


Controlling boost:
http://www.boostcontroller.com/display_page.php?i=19
http://www.turbosmartusa.com/technical- ... tallation/

How a turbo works on a subaru and breakdown:
http://www.subaru4you.co.uk/how.shtml

Ej25d td04 builds/info:
First link is one pictured above running all stock.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr ... 400http://

sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=20415
viewtopic.php?f=39&t=22065&hilit=diy+Short

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr ... ?t=2087243

[Garrison]

Well, okay; here's what I would say.

Find out what the internal wastegate is set to; if it's 6psi (which I think it is, but double check as its year specific on the td04) then forget about the manual boost controller and just run it as it is. The wastegate will open at 6psi, everything will be fine. Talking about plumbing external wastegates and such is just adding headache to your cause - if you want easy, leave the internal and run it as-is.

Crossmember
The ej22t crossmember is set up so that the routing for the exhaust can come up the side and position the turbo in the typical subie/wrx/sti position (to the passenger side of the TB); the up-pipe comes right off the header and goes into the turbo.
An N/A crossmember will not accompany an up-pipe without cutting out a section of the crossmember in that same general location. The reason people say not to do this is that it weakens the crossmember - which is a structurally important part of the car (Say, in a crash). If this doesn't bother you, then notch the crossmember like you're talking about, weld in the reinforcement plates and use WRX headers and a (DE-CATTED) up-pipe (the cat can chunk and go into the turbine)

Fuel-ling
Skip on the wrx fuel-pump; it's not going to be sufficient for your needs. Sti pump (minimum) and preferably a walbro 255 or the like (there's knockoffs on ebay for ~$50, it's what I ran, and still have in my car. Works great)
If you aren't going above 6psi, skip installing the EM until you have injectors to go with it. EM is only really needed above 8psi - as the oem injectors are basically running 100% duty cycle at WOT.
All you really need is a RRFPR, (I used vortech) and a 2:1 FMU ratio [This means that for every psi above atmosphere that is run through the FMU 2psi of fuel will be added to compensate]
This is a very safe and simple way to run your setup until you figure the minutia out- and you will always be able to resell your FMU as people always want them for exactly this type of job.

Detonation
The killer of all N/A soobs. The timing curve on these engines is absurd; and you need to do everything you can to pull heat out of the cylinder. This includes, but is not limited to: Intercooling, colder plugs, better fuel, more fuel (rich condition). The plugs are optional, but with your turbo choice I would -highly- advise using them.


TLDR: Skip the boost controller, use the interal wastegate on the turbo; get an FMU, 1-step colder plugs, and better fuel pump.

[demarioii]

So... http://www.rs25.com/forums/f105/t182828 ... h-fmu.html

Do you know that's the ratio I would use and how I can confirm that? (the ratio you said earlier)

As far as o2 sensors and or temp ones...I need one pre cat after the turbo, and one after the cat? I'm currently confused since my exhaust is all hacked up from the previous owner. It only has one o2 before the cat and huge leaks. Throwing a recirculation cel below threshold and another exhaust one.

Far as monitoring everything what would you suggest as far as a boost gauge or temp gauge. Just weld in a bung and wire it up I assume? I'd like to at least have a simple boost gauge.

And btw, thank you for the help and guidance, definitely pointing me in the right direction and I highly appreciate it.

[demarioii]

From what I understand, the wrx headers will fit. Since I'm cutting the crossmember and supporting it. This guy has cutback, headers and Uppipe that I can delete the cat from and position where I need...

http://syracuse.en.craigslist.org/pts/3993938958.html

[Garrison]

My pleasure sir


FMU
Yeah, that's the FMU - the top port is a vacuum line - that'll go to the vacuum-out on the front side of your turbo, and the bottom two ports are line-IN and line-OUT for the fuel (be sure to get high pressure fuel line and clamps for this, as it's high pressure; I didn't and dumped about 2 gallons out)

He says there's 6:1-12:1 but that's ludicrously rich, especially for oem injectors (again, placing them near 100% duty cycle). I was running 4:1 @ 7psi and it was still pig-rich. 2:1 with colder plugs is damn near perfect.


Exhaust
Oh goody! That means you get to replace everything and do it right!
3" is pretty loud, but offers the best flow.
I would find a somewhat quiet muffler and go with 2.5" (though a 3"DP is the most common, you can reduce it right afterward) - should give your little turbo plenty of breathing room.
As far as o2 sensors, there should be one pre- and one post-turbo. The placement isn't terribly important post turbo, other than you want it within 18" of the turbine exhaust housing due to some co2 nonsense, as well as the cord only being about that long. An extender (~1-1.5") will help pull the snout of the o2 sensor out of the exhaust stream which can help combat po420 code (inefficient catalytic convertor); but the real trick is finding a place to put the cat.
Ideally it would be -headers-up-pipe w/o2 sensor-turbo-downpipe w/cat & o2 sensor- tailpipe


Sensors
I'm probably not the best guy to ask about this, but from everything I've read on the subject you will want a boost gauge, as well as a *wide-band o2 sensor* (so weld another bung in the DP preemptively, and cap it for now); as most EM can read wide-band, it will give you the greatest sense of lean vs rich condition, which a tuner will use in conjunction with a dyno to tune your car. Lean = power, but can lead to detonation if too lean.

Headers
Yeah, if you're gonna notch your crossmember, as I mentioned in my previous post the wrx headers will work fine. If you're going to use the oem up-pipe just be sure you de-cat is first (a stick will suffice )

[demarioii]

Ah okay, very helpful. Now as far as a dp. Would this 02 wrx one work? I don't see why not.

[Garrison]

Yeah, that'll work - just know that any wrx exhaust will need to the be reworked at the cat-back in order to fit the legacy chassis. I think a couple of things need to be flipped, some hangers moved, and lengthened about 8"

[demarioii]

Okay sweet, I acquired since we've talked...

07 intercooler
07 wrx sti ported stock headers
Nvidia dp pictured above

What do I have to do for the breather lines? Off the bottom of the intercooler..

[Garrison]

Hmmm?

There should only be 4 holes in your intercooler 2 for post turbo inlet, 1 for TB connection, and 1 for re-circulatory valve (or BOV). Pics of what you're talking about?

[demarioii]

The 2 quarter inch tubes bottom left. Those are just vacuum lines or what?

[Garrison]

Ah yeah, those are breather tubes for the heads. Leave it on there and use your stock breathers and hook it up. the 3rd port goes to the intake

[demarioii]

[demarioii]

As far as the fmu, I'm reading the lower ratios like 3:1 and 2:1 are used mainly on upgraded injectors. And stock usually runs good with the common 12:1 and or 8:1 setups. Was I missing something. Can't really find any fmu that are in a reasonable price range with that rating.
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/page.php?id=30031

[Reuben]

You will need the complete heat shielding for those headers, well, not complete, but namely the turbo side manifold upper sheild, the one between the head and the exhaust. Many remove this shield cause it is ugly. But those who aren't idiot have the last laugh as they melt their timing covers, and then have the cambelt snap and grenade their engine. Seen it in person, seen it online many times.

That or heatwrap, as long as there is something between your exhaust manifold and timing cover basically.

[Garrison]

As far as the fmu, I'm reading the lower ratios like 3:1 and 2:1 are used mainly on upgraded injectors. And stock usually runs good with the common 12:1 and or 8:1 setups. Was I missing something. Can't really find any fmu that are in a reasonable price range with that rating.
http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/page.php?id=30031

I read through that, and honestly?

I don't know what to tell you. I have given you my experiences, but I cannot back-up my reasoning with any math. If vortech says 12:1, then they would know better than I.

The ratio disks, 2:1-4:1-6:1-10:1-12:1 can be interchanged and found on ebay.

[Garrison]

Found a vortech unit on ebay for ~ OBX money

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VORTECH-FMU-FUE ... 8d&vxp=mtr

[demarioii]

I actually do thermal coatings on formula one car exhaust as well as nascar. So I have every single part of the exhaust very very over killed with cooling. Great tip though.

As far as fuel I'll take what you said and give the company a call and see what I can find out

[west_minist]

Is your stock ECU Denso that it can be reflash using open source tools?

[liqwid]

Is your stock ECU Denso that it can be reflash using open source tools?

EJ25D has a JECS ECU

[Garrison]

Update on your progress?

[anothernord]

DIY: Turbo the EJ25D
http://www.rs25.com/forums/f105/t160188 ... ej25d.html

There's so many random parts besides just stock WRX parts you'll need. This is a big project. For example, you can't run stock WRX headers with the NA water pump.