High compression Engine Build, Dyno'd

[Grafton]

the NA board needs a build log, so here it is!

Goal: 200+ crank HP, all motor

the ingredients:
95' EJ22e dual port heads
01' EJ251 short block

the minor goodies/mods:
Delta 200 cams
solid lash adjusters
STi Oil pump
Grimm-speed 8mm manifold spacers
Port and polish done by me
EL OBX headers
FPR tuning * if needed *
MSD Coil

quick stats:
12:1 compression 2.5L
stock ej22 ecu

about the "omg ej22 heads don't flow"


According to Cobb's bench flow numbers the EJ22T heads from 193 cfm@0.350" lift on the intake side and 147 cfm@0.350" on the exhaust side
http://www.cobbtuning.com/tech/sohc/page2.html
According to MRT's numbers the EJ205 heads flow 151 cfm@0.400" lift on the intake side and 111 cfm@.0400" lift on the exhaust side.
http://www.mrtrally.com.au/performance/ click the hot link on the bottom of the page for head flow characteristics.
Of course the EJ25 heads win with 240cfm and 182cfm respectively. But I get tired of people constantly say that you MUST upgrade the EJ22 heads when doind a build because the flow like s*%&! That just isn't true. They flow all right, especially for the turbo guys...

now for the opening pictures
http://img576.imageshack.us/img576/3805/dscn0823zy.th.jpg (http://img576.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0823zy.jpg)


EJ251 shortblock
http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/6749/dscn0824.th.jpg (http://img44.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0824.jpg)

http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/5914/dscn0825.th.jpg (http://img812.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0825.jpg) http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/5350/dscn0827l.th.jpg (http://img651.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0827l.jpg)

http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/8726/dscn0829z.th.jpg (http://img828.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0829z.jpg) http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/1126/dscn0830r.th.jpg (http://img651.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0830r.jpg)

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/3426/dscn0831c.th.jpg (http://img135.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0831c.jpg) http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/1864/dscn0832x.th.jpg (http://img822.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0832x.jpg)

Crankshaft
http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/6574/dscn0835b.th.jpg (http://img819.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0835b.jpg) http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/4017/dscn0836q.th.jpg (http://img686.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0836q.jpg)

Stock head, drivers side ( to be ported )
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/651/dscn0841z.th.jpg (http://img191.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0841z.jpg) http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/5641/dscn0842.th.jpg (http://img641.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0842.jpg)

http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/3706/dscn0843c.th.jpg (http://img710.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0843c.jpg) http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/8922/dscn0844u.th.jpg (http://img202.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0844u.jpg)

http://img831.imageshack.us/img831/2166/dscn0845h.th.jpg (http://img831.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0845h.jpg) http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/526/dscn0846v.th.jpg (http://img835.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0846v.jpg)

http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/7492/dscn0839.th.jpg (http://img820.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0839.jpg) http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/9588/dscn0840nl.th.jpg (http://img189.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0840nl.jpg)

Pistons, in need of cleaning
http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/5548/dscn0847a.th.jpg (http://img829.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0847a.jpg)

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6153/dscn0849.th.jpg (http://img178.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0849.jpg) http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/976/dscn0851c.th.jpg (http://img682.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0851c.jpg)

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/4505/dscn0852.th.jpg (http://img843.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0852.jpg) http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/3066/dscn0853dz.th.jpg (http://img837.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0853dz.jpg)

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/4788/dscn0854q.th.jpg (http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0854q.jpg) http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/4484/dscn0855b.th.jpg (http://img828.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0855b.jpg)

Ported head (passenger side)
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/7186/dscn0856.th.jpg (http://img444.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0856.jpg) http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/1065/dscn0857j.th.jpg (http://img715.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0857j.jpg)

http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/4137/dscn0858h.th.jpg (http://img839.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0858h.jpg) http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/2429/dscn0859a.th.jpg (http://img85.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0859a.jpg)

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/8676/dscn0860j.th.jpg (http://img507.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0860j.jpg) http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/2645/dscn0861l.th.jpg (http://img69.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0861l.jpg)

http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/160/dscn0862ew.th.jpg (http://img693.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0862ew.jpg) http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/1310/dscn0863a.th.jpg (http://img413.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0863a.jpg)

[mike-tracy]

That's very cool, but do you have engine management in your future? Fuel injectors & pump?

[Airgne]

i will tell you that you do not want straight 2000grinds. go with 2000/1000/ grind cams. n/a engines need some back pressure.

[Grafton]

That's very cool, but do you have engine management in your future? Fuel injectors & pump?
nothing but a modified stock fuel pressure regulator atm, to up the psi on the rails therefore flowing more and changing the open loop afr closed loop should adjust itself
I'd like a pp6 to really tune it... in the future


i will tell you that you do not want straight 2000grinds. go with 2000/1000/ grind cams. n/a engines need some back pressure.

there are only 2 grinds for the phase 1 ej22 cam 220 (torque, aka 1000) or the 230 (hp, aka 2000)

and i'm very sure about the cam choice, with the 220's I'd get off idle power up to ~5k rpms and it'd fall off like stock, thats not what I'm after

with the 230's I wont start making real power till 1800-2200 rpm but it'll keep making power till redline. I need the large overlap to bleed off cylindar pressure at low rpm's and because of the high static compresson I'll start making power sooner rather than later. and i don't normally drive under 2k rpms anyway
plus I should have a loopy idle, sexy!

[Airgne]

talk to ken at delta cams.

also call dom at maxwell power and talk to him about your build. he is one of the few that i would trust with my car.

[datdookie]

OH WHA! Finally a high compression thread. Hoping to see how this all turns out because im going the same route except im going with the 25d motor instead of the 251 because of re-wiring. What pistons/rods are you using?

[ouch1011]

If you cut the loop off the passenger side exhaust, all you'll have is a UEL header. There is no compromise, its either equal length or it isn't. About the only benefit you'll get is from the longer primary tubes, but you'd get more power from just leaving it alone.

Otherwise, good luck with your build.

[subie/legacy]

what head gasket do you plan on using? and isn't there some controversy about water passages not matching up on either gasket to heads, or gasket to block?
I like what your doing here, and might wan't to do this myself one day.

[httrdd]

What is your expected completion time? I would like to see this motor in action.

[Grafton]

talk to ken at delta cams.

also call dom at maxwell power and talk to him about your build. he is one of the few that i would trust with my car.

Talked to Ken, I'll shoot an email to dom thanks for the tip


OH WHA! Finally a high compression thread. Hoping to see how this all turns out because im going the same route except im going with the 25d motor instead of the 251 because of re-wiring. What pistons/rods are you using?

if your using your ej22 heads and manifold it doesn't matter about the 25d or 251 no re wiring necessary, stock pistons & rods just with new rings and bearings


If you cut the loop off the passenger side exhaust, all you'll have is a UEL header. There is no compromise, its either equal length or it isn't. About the only benefit you'll get is from the longer primary tubes, but you'd get more power from just leaving it alone.

Otherwise, good luck with your build.

thanks, very true it will be completely UEL but it's going to be a close ratio and *shouldn't* collide the pulses like a brola so it should make more power than a replica style UEL, I have that same design on my 2.2 right now and it makes a LOT of torque (other than my pulley only power mod is headers) but that might be due to the nice long primaries


what head gasket do you plan on using? and isn't there some controversy about water passages not matching up on either gasket to heads, or gasket to block?
I like what your doing here, and might wan't to do this myself one day.

I'm using the cometic hybrid design H1631SPK040S, http://www.sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14956 just ordering it thinner than normal


What is your expected completion time? I would like to see this motor in action.
End of September, depending on part deliveries and machine shop time, I *hope* to have everything ordered by the end of the week along with finishing the porting job

[Airgne]

why are you goin to use stock pistons and rods?

why not some cp pistions and pauter rods to be safe?

[Grafton]

why are you goin to use stock pistons and rods?

why not some cp pistions and pauter rods to be safe?
limited budget, the stock components seem to hold up fine in other high compression hybrids we'll see about this one though.This is technically a "rebuild" honestly there will be more money in the seals & gaskets than anything else ~400
I'll post my projected budget after classes today

[Airgne]

Subaru Impreza, Legacy, Outback Sport, Baja, Forester, 16V DOHC H4 F.Inj. 99-07 (see kit #'s for specific years)
Engine
Code Stock
Bore Includes: Kit #/Price
EJ25 99.5mm Complete Gasket Set
MLS Head Gasket
ROSS/Wiseco Pistons
(99.5mm, 100mm, 101mm) and
(8.5-1, 9.0-1, 9.5-1, 10.0-1, 10.5-1 comp ratio)
Performance Rings
Performance Wrist Pins
TOGA HP Main Bearings
TOGA HP Rod Bearings
Timing Belt

Additional Parts Available:
K1 / Carrillo Rods Impreza, Legacy, Outback Sport, Baja 99-03
Forester 99-00
EKSSU11LMPX
$1099

Impreza, Legacy, Outback Sport, Baja 04-07 (gasoline)
EKSSU11SLMPX
$1099

Impreza, Legacy, Outback Sport, Baja 04-07 (TURBO)
EKSSU15MPX
$1099


Call to Order:
(603) 378-0090

[subie/legacy]

I'm using the cometic hybrid design H1631SPK040S, viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14956 (http://www.sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14956) just ordering it thinner than normal

Ok thanks. I was reading up on these frankenbuilds not to long ago, and guess i my have over looked that they made such a gasket.

[Reason]

Cometic makes a gasket for this hybrid, I plan on doing a build very similar to this one.

[Grafton]

budget breakdown:
Gaskets:
ej25 lower set $25
ej22 upper set $40

mechanical:
timing belt kit (idlers, water pump, & belt) $105
NPR piston rings $50
ACL Race main bearings $70
ACL Race rod bearings $55
Valve springs, retainers,& collete's $100
Cam regrinds $200
MSD Coil $70
Manifold spacers $90

machine shop labor $100

already acquired a few months ago:

95' ej22 long block $80, just needed the heads from it
01' ej251 short block $120 was pre-dissembled for me
OBX EL headers $150 used on ebay
sti Oil pump, $40 barely used from a friend
new oil pan, pick up and head bolts $140 dealership

pictures of some more stuff
Oil pick up, stock
http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/7480/dscn0865.th.jpg (http://img834.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0865.jpg)

STi 10mm oil pump
http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/399/dscn0866g.th.jpg (http://img718.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0866g.jpg) http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/674/dscn0867j.th.jpg (http://img163.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0867j.jpg)

head bolts and drivers side head plug
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/8112/dscn0868c.th.jpg (http://img825.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0868c.jpg) http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/5268/dscn0869a.th.jpg (http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0869a.jpg)

new oil pan
http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/8290/dscn0870l.th.jpg (http://img535.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0870l.jpg) http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/1993/dscn0871o.th.jpg (http://img843.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0871o.jpg)

[ouch1011]

This is cool, NA builds are fun as long as you are realistic in your goals (which it looks like you are). As long as you don't go (too far) over the stock redline, the stock bottom end should have no problem with your goals. If you go past the stock redline, with those aggressive cams and SOHC rocker arms (heavy) the valvetrain will probably become the weak link. You'll just have to be careful at low RPMs to make sure not to lug the engine. Probably won't be an issue with the aggressive cam grind, but high compression at low RPM can result in pounding the crap out of the rod and main bearings, even if there is no detonation. It can also build a lot of heat in the pistons--most high compression engines use forged pistons.

[Grafton]

^ thanks, I've run into a small problem, the crankshaft i was going to use acquired some scratches in it that i had not noticed what i bought it. when i took it to the machine shop and they pointed them out i felt it was time to find another crankshaft, I've got a line on a balanced sti crank, if i can get the price right i'll get it.

[Grafton]

yay double post!

dirty intake valve:
http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/69/imag0064z.jpg (http://img375.imageshack.us/i/imag0064z.jpg/)

and through a magic process volia clean:
http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/2594/imag0065k.jpg (http://img834.imageshack.us/i/imag0065k.jpg/)

first parts in the mail, grimmspeed spacers,
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/9494/dscn0877v.jpg (http://img638.imageshack.us/i/dscn0877v.jpg/)

cams are on the way to delta, engine block is at the machine shop, heads will go when i have the parts to build them

[JunkerXL]

:smt007 cant wait. i was pondering doing this with my 25 block. :D

[Reason]

OoooOoO more pics

[datdookie]

god damn man im loving this thread more and more cant wait till i get my money up. My motor is waiting on me... oh and are those valve springs and retainers upgraded or just brand new stock/oem because im trying to raise my rpm to 7000 or 7500

[Grafton]

god damn man im loving this thread more and more cant wait till i get my money up. My motor is waiting on me... oh and are those valve springs and retainers upgraded or just brand new stock/oem because im trying to raise my rpm to 7000 or 7500

I'm glad, the major parts for this build have been sitting in my computer room since march, I didn't have or the money (no job) to get started, but i am employed again so huryay money!

I'm sticking with the stock redline and stock springs, i never ran across anyone selling upgraded springs, if anybody has them delta might know where to get them. but the rumor is that the stock valve train is good till 6600-6700 i think, but lacking a tunable ecu i'm stuck with 6250 dun dun duuuhhhhh. :/

well now it's time to make a 4.5 hr drive to pick up a Cobb balanced crankshaft in pa

[httrdd]

Looks good! Keep on truckin buddy!

[Airgne]

you will be able to get 200 crank out of it. i got around 210 crank with cams, intake, exhaust, and slight tune.

[Reason]

Pssh, I want 200 at the wheels

[Grafton]

Might need new pistons, according to the machine shop the bore clearance is .004" that's double the limit but I am going to check myself incase they forgot to do the math (bore-piston)/2= clearance

In good news I made friends with the ups guy today and he dropped of some parts

oil filter spacer and temp sender fron glowshift, they're sending me a din mount for my gauges bc my gauges didn't fit in the a piller mount
http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/5343/dscn0878.th.jpg (http://img838.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0878.jpg)

nice clean pistons that are pretty worn
http://img704.imageshack.us/img704/6416/dscn0879p.th.jpg (http://img704.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0879p.jpg)

piston pins
http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/9169/dscn0880q.th.jpg (http://img718.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0880q.jpg)

Clean rods
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/9381/dscn0881w.th.jpg (http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0881w.jpg)

new valve springs, retainers & lock clips
http://img576.imageshack.us/img576/1904/dscn0882.th.jpg (http://img576.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0882.jpg)

timing belt & idlers
http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/2936/dscn0883.th.jpg (http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0883.jpg)

new water pump
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/9716/dscn0884b.th.jpg (http://img444.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0884b.jpg)
http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/6784/dscn0885x.th.jpg (http://img412.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0885x.jpg)
http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/3291/dscn0886e.th.jpg (http://img28.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0886e.jpg)

Tribecca front swaybar
http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/5387/dscn0887.th.jpg (http://img827.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0887.jpg)

EJ25 lower gasket set
http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/1928/dscn0888b.th.jpg (http://img210.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0888b.jpg)

valve cover gaskets
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/7081/dscn0889r.th.jpg (http://img130.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0889r.jpg)

cometic head gaskets
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/96/dscn0890j.th.jpg (http://img825.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0890j.jpg)

ej22 upper gasket set
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/185/dscn0891f.th.jpg (http://img822.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0891f.jpg)
http://img231.imageshack.us/img231/5436/dscn0892j.th.jpg (http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0892j.jpg)
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/7614/dscn0893q.th.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0893q.jpg)
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9643/dscn0896l.th.jpg (http://img825.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0896l.jpg)

[Reason]

Exciting!

[JunkerXL]

mmmmmmmmmm cant wait for the next episode all those parts going in, math, pistons, it's like an action movie for car nerds, in slo-mo



:smt020

[StatGSR]

it's like an action movie for car nerds, in slo-mo

I think that made my day! :grin:

[Grafton]

it's like an action movie for car nerds, in slo-mo

I think that made my day! :grin:

mine too lol

fine here's some math for you :D
piston to bore clearance = bore-piston

bore pistons clearance
1 3.9180" 3.9164" 0.0016"
2 3.9180" 3.9150" 0.0030"
3 3.9180" 3.9164" 0.0016"
4 3.9180" 3.9140" 0.0040"

standard clearance is .0004"-.0012"
Limit .0020"

2 past standard, and 2 past the limit time for new pistons
hooray math

[JunkerXL]

** ghostly voice ** replace.....piston.....4..............ooOOOooo000oOOo.....(and prolly 2.......ooooOOOoo00o0oooo...) :lurk:



:smt020


(edit: just hecklin ya. dunno if it's even a good idea to replace only 2 lol)

[datdookie]

one of my favorite threads on this forum

[Grafton]

Still on the fence about pistons #2 & #4, but the ported heads are at the machine shop once more getting a valve job done so they'll be ready to have the valves installed :D

EDIT: no longer on the fence about the pistons I'm getting 4 new oem pistons after i get paid it just seems like a bad idea to mix worn and new parts in the engine, and the idea of doing that has rubbed me wrong all day, now i need to get 4 nice A pistons and my clearance will be .0009"-.0013" nice and tight :D

I want to begin assembly this sunday, but I still need to clean the crank and plasty-gauge(sp?) everything, get my heads and cams back, decide what I'm going to do about my two too small pistons (woo english fun lol) and modify my oil pan baffle and now get paid to order new pistons

my overall plan is:

At my apartment: clean everything, double check my clearances, and put the new valve springs etc... into the head
wrap my OBX headers, not in the budget atm to modify them... :(
get the gauges (oil temp & pressure + voltage) installed in my 2nd din slot and ready to be wired in the engine bay

In my uncle's garage ( owes me a small favor :D )
weekend 1
1 day

final short block assembly, mount it on the engine stand and install the heads, tape up the block and heads and paint them semi-gloss black


weekend 2
day 1

Pull my 2.2 and steal parts : Intake manifold, injectors, rocker arms, dipstick tube, a few bolts here & there
paint the last few items with high temp paint (manifold & TB)
GUT my engine bay of everything removable, degrease it and paint it flat black ( makes the engine "pop" from within the bay )

day 2
finish assembly of the engine, reassemble engine bay double check fluids & timing before first start

during the week on a day off:

prime the motor ( cranking with no plugs or fuel, to get oil flowing )
leak check, Attempt first start <- I'll try to video this but i might forget
figure out why it didn't start (lol i have faith in my mechanical skills)
begin the break in process with a ~15 min fast idle (1500rpm) let it cool then 4 30-50-30 cycles via engine braking and light throttle, progressing to 4 20-50-20 cycles with heavy throttle, then 6 cycles from 20 to 55 @ WOT let it cool again, then 1000 miles of normal driving

first oil change @ 500mi + valve clearance check
2nd oil change @ 1500
and it's broke in and ready to be beat on
*evil laugh*

[Zac]

really looking forward to this, planning to do something similar once I pick up another legacy.

Good luck!!

[JunkerXL]

:smt038 :smt038 :smt038 :smt038 win! +1 for realistic planning. my head a-splode with anticipation. +100000 for piston decision :smt023 what to do with the old pistons.... can i pay to ship them? they would make good cigar ash trays :grin:



:smt020

[Grafton]

i don't know how well of an ash tray these pistons would make but i'm thinking after some bandsaw work id have an awesome set of coasters, but they'd have to pass the wife test (dun dun daa) let me figure out how much it'll be to ship you a piston and I'll pm you about it

[JunkerXL]

word.

[Shale]

Oh wow...this thread is relevant to my interests!

You seem so organised and methodical about a very realistic build. It's going to be exciting seeing the beast in action.

*subscribed!

[Grafton]

lol thanks i'm reconsidering the whole engine bay painting, but the block and everything will be

and i found a perfect use for 2 of my pistons in the short term, replacement couch leg :D

right now i am just waiting on parts to ship and stuff to get back from the machine shop... waiting sucks

the wife wants the disassembled engine block out of the living room asap and i want a motor built

[JunkerXL]

im on pins and needles!!! cmon man updatE!!



:smt020

[httrdd]

lol thanks i'm reconsidering the whole engine bay painting, but the block and everything will be

and i found a perfect use for 2 of my pistons in the short term, replacement couch leg :D

right now i am just waiting on parts to ship and stuff to get back from the machine shop... waiting sucks

the wife wants the disassembled engine block out of the living room asap and i want a motor built

Freakin classic!

[Grafton]

new pics this afternoon ~2PM

Quick & dirty in class update:
heads are back from the machine shop,
i nearly ruined an exhaust valve seat in a porting slip,
the old exhaust valves are burnt beyond repair, 4 intakes valves are no good,
16 new valves ordered, should ship @ same time as the pistons (end of this week beginng of next week)

I expect the cams to show up today

[JunkerXL]

:smt007 :smt007 :smt007 JOY!!! :smt007 :smt007 :smt007



:smt020

[Grafton]

I am going to become a very patient person by the time all the parts get here in the mail...

some pictures, as promised:

My current "project storage"
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/8173/dscn0906v.jpg (http://img64.imageshack.us/i/dscn0906v.jpg/)

paint progress
water pump
http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/7227/dscn0903i.th.jpg (http://img202.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0903i.jpg)
valve cover
http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/9113/dscn0905nl.th.jpg (http://img833.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0905nl.jpg)
http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/3884/dscn0904.th.jpg (http://img843.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0904.jpg)

exhaust valve seats, that i nearly ruined while porting
http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/1240/imag0071r.th.jpg (http://img826.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imag0071r.jpg)
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/3783/imag0072y.th.jpg (http://img822.imageshack.us/my.php?image=imag0072y.jpg)

the 4 good intake valves:
http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/43/dscn0909q.th.jpg (http://img340.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0909q.jpg)

bag of bad valves
http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/9290/dscn0910.th.jpg (http://img844.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0910.jpg)

the bad valves, the dark line in the center of the sealing area is where they are burnt and no good
http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/8296/dscn0911t.th.jpg (http://img829.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0911t.jpg)
http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/8574/dscn0912w.th.jpg (http://img687.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0912w.jpg)
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/1483/dscn0913s.th.jpg (http://img64.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0913s.jpg)
http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/267/dscn0914h.th.jpg (http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0914h.jpg)

valves installed for shits and giggles
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/535/dscn0915.th.jpg (http://img696.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0915.jpg)

extra projects:
DIY mudflaps
http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/3957/dscn0916q.th.jpg (http://img688.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0916q.jpg)
Tribecca FSB
http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/6800/dscn0917d.th.jpg (http://img693.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0917d.jpg)

[JunkerXL]

nice. burned valves can have the small end ground to a point and used as nails, or home defense weapons :grin:

howd u choose the head cover colors?



nice work so far!.




:smt020

[Grafton]

howd u choose the head cover colors?

wanted to go with a blue/black theme with the engine after seeing a gold/black power coated SVX engine in carlisle @ the import show, the blue(ford blue lol) was the only blue engine paint i could find that I liked the shade of, everything else was too dull/dark

as a note to anyone who wants to two tone the older sohc valve covers, masking tape works better to get a clean edge, on the one I posted, I ran out of masking tape and had to go with blue painters tape and it didn't hold the edge very well

[JunkerXL]

hmm go fig :smt017 try green body man tape. thats stuff rox all faces off :smt023



:smt020

[Grafton]

a warning to people buying delta cams, don't open them from the bottom: packaging of messy doom
http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/5117/dscn0918e.th.jpg (http://img25.imageshack.us/i/dscn0918e.jpg/)

YAY CAMS!
http://img375.imageshack.us/img375/1056/dscn0924z.th.jpg (http://img375.imageshack.us/i/dscn0924z.jpg/)

The heads are painted!
http://img528.imageshack.us/img528/2724/dscn0919l.th.jpg (http://img528.imageshack.us/i/dscn0919l.jpg/)
http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/3574/dscn0920lm.th.jpg (http://img97.imageshack.us/i/dscn0920lm.jpg/)
http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/1683/dscn0921k.th.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/dscn0921k.jpg/)

gauges:
http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/3731/dscn0922v.th.jpg (http://img832.imageshack.us/i/dscn0922v.jpg/)

and an awesome shirt:
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/1094/dscn0926ok.th.jpg (http://img690.imageshack.us/i/dscn0926ok.jpg/)
http://img259.imageshack.us/img259/9537/dscn0925n.th.jpg (http://img259.imageshack.us/i/dscn0925n.jpg/)

[Reason]

I have that shirt!!! And where did you get that gauge DIN pocket? The last one I had didn't fit properly.

[httrdd]

Nice!

[Grafton]

I have that shirt!!! And where did you get that gauge DIN pocket? The last one I had didn't fit properly.

glow-shift, and I don't know about fitment yet but am going to make it fit!

[JunkerXL]

i like how the rsx is driving away in shame :smt023 cant wait till its one piece :smt007



:smt020

[Grafton]

Shipping update: valves get here tomorrow, pistons next tuesday :D
going to work on modding the oil pan today, pics later

[JunkerXL]

:smt036 i love it when a plan comes together :hal

[Grafton]

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/9061/hannibalo.jpg

[JunkerXL]

lol WIN!



:smt020

[Grafton]

Received my new valves today via UPS
so i decided to assemble my heads :D

http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/3884/dscn0927cp.th.jpg (http://img842.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0927cp.jpg)

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/6813/dscn0928a.th.jpg (http://img716.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0928a.jpg)

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/325/dscn0930r.th.jpg (http://img517.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0930r.jpg)

http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/2124/dscn0931o.th.jpg (http://img827.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0931o.jpg)

Oil pan mini mod
according to nasioc the pre-06 oil pans might be a cause for oil starvation because the oil couldn't get back down to the pickup and in high-g turns and acceleration/braking possibly getting caught in-between the two baffles. So I added two more normal sized holes to the upper baffle and then created two small holes in the second baffle, hopefully this will help prevent any problems that *could* arise
http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/5949/dscn0932q.th.jpg (http://img196.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0932q.jpg)

http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/8922/dscn0933o.th.jpg (http://img693.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0933o.jpg)

[04Wagoon]

What you said about the oil pan is possibly what happened to starve my WRX... I was taking a long slow corner, at fairly high speed, (which turned it into a high speed corner i guess) and when i got off the highway I could hear the beginings of some really bad knocking... thus spun bearing... im going to steal your idea for the oil pan when i rebuild it.. great build thread by the way

[Grafton]

What you said about the oil pan is possibly what happened to starve my WRX... I was taking a long slow corner, at fairly high speed, (which turned it into a high speed corner i guess) and when i got off the highway I could hear the beginings of some really bad knocking... thus spun bearing... im going to steal your idea for the oil pan when i rebuild it.. great build thread by the way

save yourself the effort and get an 06+ oil pan and a killer b oil pickup, i wanted to do that but this is a budget build

[Zac]

did you do any porting in the heads?

[Grafton]

did you do any porting in the heads?

yeah, gasket matched the intake, thinned the devider(sp?) but not knife edged, flattened down the plue tube intrusion in the intake ports and really worked the short side radius smooth. With the exhaust I ovaled the dogleg port, opened both ports ~1mm, hit the short side radius again and put an awesome polish in the ports

the funny thing is I didn't have a set of gaskets to go off of while porting, I managed it by hand, talk about lucky, really gasket matching the ej22 head hardly removes that much materal, which is why I focused on "smoothing" the path the intake charge would have to take.

I figure this is one of those 80/20 things ie 20% of the work gets 80% of the job done and I wasn't about to pay ~1k to have the heads ported when i have 60 in tools and 4-5 hrs of time and will have almost the same effect

[JunkerXL]

here here!! fix em if u got em! PICS PICS PICS!!!

[04Wagoon]

What you said about the oil pan is possibly what happened to starve my WRX... I was taking a long slow corner, at fairly high speed, (which turned it into a high speed corner i guess) and when i got off the highway I could hear the beginings of some really bad knocking... thus spun bearing... im going to steal your idea for the oil pan when i rebuild it.. great build thread by the way

save yourself the effort and get an 06+ oil pan and a killer b oil pickup, i wanted to do that but this is a budget build

thanks, the effort is fine with me, I could use some savings anywhere i can get it qwhile rebuilding. I will look into the pickup and pan though

[chuckthefuk]

:-o I cant believe I've never seen your build.

Subscribed!

-Chuck

[JunkerXL]

im impatiantly tapping my keyboard waiting for PICS~! lol im sure hes busy, but im going crazy waiting for the next episode




:smt020

[Grafton]

im impatiantly tapping my keyboard waiting for PICS~! lol im sure hes busy, but im going crazy waiting for the next episode




:smt020
did you see the last set on the bottom of page 2?

[JunkerXL]

how did i miss those?! man, it's coming along nicely. i bet she screams, when its all said and done. nice work so far. :smt023



:smt020

[Grafton]

today I've indexed the new spark plugs, and stripped out this bolt:
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/8601/strippedvt.jpg (http://img26.imageshack.us/i/strippedvt.jpg/)
while using a torque wrench fsm says 10 ftlbs i had it set for 9 and it still stripped helicoil for me yay

[Grafton]

double post, got the pistons I ordered, but they are for the phase2 ej22, yay useless parts

[Reason]

Ouch

[StatGSR]

So did you order them wrong or who messed up?

[Grafton]

So did you order them wrong or who messed up?
I thought I ordered ej251 pistons, but the discription was wrong, the part number was for EJ 222 'A' pistons, so because the website had the wrong description, I ordered the wrong part, and I didn't have a vin # for them to check the order against so they shipped them out, according to their (not naming company) policy they dont have to do a thing, but they are going to exchange the 2.2 pistons for the 2.5 pistions and i'll have to pay the difference in price + shipping

fair enough seeing as they dont have to do anything

there's always something... lol it seems like by the time I finish I'll have no used parts left lol

[Reason]

Should have bought the parts from me :smt023

[Grafton]

i would have if i knew you sold oem parts, fix your website lol, so with the whole piston debacle its setting me back at least another week & half so i might start building by the end of the month depending on shipping

if i was gonna be stuck with those pistons i'd have my 2.2 honed to where they fit and rebuilt it to as a toy motor

[Reason]

The wesite is being built. I should see the first stage soon so I can make edits. I would love to have it done in oct but doubt it will happen. As for oem parts, they may be available to me.

Did you see the dyno thread?

[JunkerXL]

:smt010 piston sadness, for the loss. patience is a virtue.

oh well at least they are being flexible, all things considered. :smt023

now i have to rebuild my ej25. gotta quit being lazy




:smt020

[Grafton]

correct pistons are heading my way via UPS, I paid for 2 day so they should be here Friday and assembly starting Saturday evening YAY

I should have a nice picture update of the new pistons on Friday and the first assembly pics Saturday night, if all goes to plan it *should* be ready to go in on Monday *muh ha ha ha*

[JunkerXL]

WOOT! :smt038



:smt020

[Grafton]

no boring pistons shots today, ASSEMBLY PICS woo,

I decided to start building today, all i got done was the plastigauge on the rod & mains clearance, then the piston ring end gaps, the the piston ring clearance

I was in the process of checking the clearances on the rod bearings, all within the standard limit
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/4899/dscn0934m.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/i/dscn0934m.jpg/)

Checking the main bearings, all 18 bolts torqued, even the little 10mm, also everything good clearance wise
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/5197/dscn0935q.jpg (http://img215.imageshack.us/i/dscn0935q.jpg/)

checking the ring end gap
http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/6639/dscn0936q.jpg (http://img22.imageshack.us/i/dscn0936q.jpg/)

piston with the rings installed
http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/6451/dscn0937i.jpg (http://img3.imageshack.us/i/dscn0937i.jpg/)

[subie/legacy]

nice.. good to see you can finally start assembling your motor.
So if all goes as planed (which most likely will) when would you be putting this franken legacy on the dyno?

[Grafton]

@ the sl-i dyno day, if i can make it, it's an hour closer to me this year but still about 8 hrs

[Grafton]

Yay double post, now with video :D

installing rods onto crankshaft
http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/8215/dscn0939f.jpg (http://img651.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0939f.jpg)

rods installed:
http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/4940/dscn0940r.jpg (http://img820.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0940r.jpg)

Main bearings lube'd:
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/2492/dscn0941v.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0941v.jpg)

Block assembled
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/9104/dscn0942vx.jpg (http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0942vx.jpg)
http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/4660/dscn0943.jpg (http://img842.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0943.jpg)

Piston #1 installed
http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/9703/dscn0944c.jpg (http://img651.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0944c.jpg)

working on Piston #2
http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/6821/dscn0945n.jpg (http://img707.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0945n.jpg)

Assembled short block!
http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/1591/dscn0951lp.jpg (http://img21.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0951lp.jpg)

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9383/dscn0952x.jpg (http://img20.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0952x.jpg)

Finally you tube link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9rRZ7CBy5Y

[subie/legacy]

Thanks..now I want one!!
good work, nice progress, keep it up

[mike-tracy]

Nice, I've never seen a piston with new rings go in that easy. Or maybe I've just been unlucky :-(

Good work, thanks for the updates

[httrdd]

Thanks for the vid. So when is the install?

[Grafton]

Nice, I've never seen a piston with new rings go in that easy. Or maybe I've just been unlucky :-(

Good work, thanks for the updates

I only had issues with #3 and that was because the lower oil ring was popping out on me, the other three went in like that one


Thanks for the vid. So when is the install?

I believe thursday, paint is going to happen tuesday along with everything else i have to install that doesn't come from the other engine then thursday is the "steal parts from my 2.2" day

First tank of 93 went in today, no worries of any 89 going into then new motor

And I don't believe I've mentioned this here but my internals are very close to being balanced, only .3g off of perfection, I used the engineering department's scales to weight everything other than the crank ( it's a cobb balanced crank anyways) and matched pistons and rods biased on weight.the numbers look like this:

#3 1162.8g - #4 1163.1g <- 0.3g off of each other
#1 1163.2g - #2 1163.2g < matched to the 10th of a gram

the reason the off balance stuff is in the rear is because it's closer to the flywheel which acts as a "ground" for any small vibrations that might arise threfor limiting there influence on the rest of the rotating assembly.

and now for a progress update, no videos today:

extra case bolts also work very well to attach the block to an engine stand :D
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/2884/dscn0953m.jpg (http://img638.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0953m.jpg)

On the stand ready for oil control parts
http://img512.imageshack.us/img512/876/dscn0954m.jpg (http://img512.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0954m.jpg)

Ej22e baffle plate (plate needs to match oil pan)
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/1291/dscn0955e.jpg (http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0955e.jpg)

New oil pickup, wanted a fancy killerB pickup but it wasn't in the budget
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/6692/dscn0956y.jpg (http://img215.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0956y.jpg)

goofing around test fitting the oil & water pumps'
http://img571.imageshack.us/img571/5171/dscn0957d.jpg (http://img571.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0957d.jpg)

test fit the oil pan
http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/9463/dscn0958ct.jpg (http://img96.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0958ct.jpg)

no gasket for the oil pan just a nice layer of permatex
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/4136/dscn0959u.jpg (http://img638.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0959u.jpg)

shiny new bolts
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/4908/dscn0960.jpg (http://img63.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0960.jpg)

Getting ready to install the heads, cleaned the block
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/2944/dscn0961n.jpg (http://img521.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0961n.jpg)

head gasket in place and lined up correctly
http://img543.imageshack.us/img543/6425/dscn0962.jpg (http://img543.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0962.jpg)

head in place
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/1013/dscn0963i.jpg (http://img299.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0963i.jpg)

head-bolts dropped in, lots of threading in to do,
http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/1585/dscn0964w.jpg (http://img718.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0964w.jpg)

Bam both heads installed via the crazy torque sequence ( torque, torque, loosen, loosen, torque, torque, 90 more degrees)
http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/7638/dscn0970o.jpg (http://img121.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0970o.jpg)

oil pump installed
http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/1328/dscn0971z.jpg (http://img688.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscn0971z.jpg)

EDIT I *think* i might've used the wrong o-ring in between the case halves in the coolant pipe, at this point i'll find out when i do the first start up, if i get coolant in my oil then i know, a second set set of head gaskets and tear the block in half and fix. but i hope i used the right one, next time i work on it i'll double check against my ej22 case.

[JunkerXL]

"EDIT I *think* i might've used the wrong o-ring in between the case halves in the coolant pipe, at this point i'll find out when i do the first start up, if i get coolant in my oil then i know, a second set set of head gaskets and tear the block in half and fix. but i hope i used the right one, next time i work on it i'll double check against my ej22 case."

aint that the way it is? :roll: hang in there, your doin great. worst case scenario, we get to see more pics. lol :lol: seriously though, id do it now, while its out of the car. its a pain, but murphy's law dictates you will be pulling it out again. :shock: great pics, and ty for the vid! im excited :grin:



:smt020

[Grafton]

"EDIT I *think* i might've used the wrong o-ring in between the case halves in the coolant pipe, at this point i'll find out when i do the first start up, if i get coolant in my oil then i know, a second set set of head gaskets and tear the block in half and fix. but i hope i used the right one, next time i work on it i'll double check against my ej22 case."

aint that the way it is? :roll: hang in there, your doin great. worst case scenario, we get to see more pics. lol :lol: seriously though, id do it now, while its out of the car. its a pain, but murphy's law dictates you will be pulling it out again. :shock: great pics, and ty for the vid! im excited :grin:



:smt020

I'm not tearing it apart until i know i need to, I've heard that the cometic gaskets are reusable, I emailed cometic to find out for sure, tomorrow I'll double check the o-rings I have left over against the 2.2 case I've got laying around if I find that Id put the wrong one in there and the head gaskets will survive a re-torquing, I'll pull 2 pistons and split the block re-seal and be certain.

[JunkerXL]

yikes. well either way, im sure when it's all said and done, you motor will sing. good work so far :smt023



:smt020

[TGX4776]

think it will be ready for the meet on Saturday?

[Grafton]

think it will be ready for the meet on Saturday?

no :-( it is going in on Saturday, today i tore the motor apart and put it back together to find out I did in fact use the correct o-ring for the coolant passage... but i did manage to get the block painted and the water pump installed, it looks mean all blacked out, plus the blue looks so much better against the black

the game plan is parts stripping/painting on Saturday, i believe i am done with permatex so i'll only need to wait on the paint to dry, before i can install the painted bits onto my new engine, and drop it into it's new home

http://img816.imageshack.us/img816/4060/image083q.jpg (http://img816.imageshack.us/i/image083q.jpg/)

[JunkerXL]

ooooh shiny. i like the black block. if i get around to workin on my 2.5 i'll prolly do that, with an sti pink cross pipe. cant wait to see it in the car :smt007 :smt007



:smt020

[Zac]

so awesome, cant wait to see this thing running!

[Grafton]

so awesome, cant wait to see this thing running!
same here, finally pulled the 2.2 out, i've got everything but the drvier's side rockers, motor mounts and the timing belt cover on the new motor so it's *almost* ready to drop in.

i have class & work today, so tomorrow morning it should be finished

pictures when i remimber my camera lol

[JunkerXL]

lol i keep forgetting to post over on my thread for the same reason :roll: we've waited this long, we can wait some more :lol:




:smt020

[Grafton]

IT'S ALIVE

MUH HA HA HA

pictures tomorrow + start up video

edit, wow i likely havn't gone full bore yet and i cant wait i know 1st gear is going to be very short

catless is LOUD

[Grafton]

start up video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVOtDCKqmKs

[Soul Shinobi]

I'm typing these as I read through the whole thread, so there are a lot of questions (sorry! :razz:):

1. How exactly did you calculate the compression ratio?
2. Did you have the head or block resurfaced/ground to improve compression?
3. Is the stroke of the STi crank different than the NA one?
4. How much did balancing the crank cost?
5. What did the OEM pistons cost? Oh sweet the Phase II pistons have the molybdenum coatings, I forgot!
6. That tapping the ring compressor onto the headgasket mating surface of the block is concerning! Ah! So's the grabbing the wrist pin with pliers!

[JunkerXL]

woot! :smt023 sounds spot on! :smt005 cant wait to hear how she runs :smt007 :smt007 :smt007




great work!
:smt020

[chuckthefuk]

double w00t

[TGX4776]

Aren't all cranks balanced from factory?

[Grafton]

I'm typing these as I read through the whole thread, so there are a lot of questions (sorry! :razz:):

1. How exactly did you calculate the compression ratio?
2. Did you have the head or block resurfaced/ground to improve compression?
3. Is the stroke of the STi crank different than the NA one?
4. How much did balancing the crank cost?
5. What did the OEM pistons cost? Oh sweet the Phase II pistons have the molybdenum coatings, I forgot!
6. That tapping the ring compressor onto the headgasket mating surface of the block is concerning! Ah! So's the grabbing the wrist pin with pliers!

1. used published data to calculate the compression ratio, i didn't cc anything for a highly acurate # could be as low as 11.6:1 (still high) or past 12:1
2 no resurfacing, i am using a .027" headgasket though that was worth approx 4 tenths to the compression
3 all 2.5 phase 2 cranks are the same
4. bought the crank used was out of a cobb stroker kit for a 2L wrx so it was
already balenced, and i believe the factory cranks can be about 2-3grams out of balence
5 pistons were about 60 each @ subarugenuineparts.com
6. you kind've need to tap the ring compressor or the oil rings jam up on you, plus i didn't hit hard enough to mar the surface, same deal with the wrist in i didn't leave any marks on itlll

[Grafton]

Well it's in there and she run's like a raped ape :D

i do have a small oil leak from the back of the motor, i believe it's the separator plate, lol 170k on the 2.2 with a plastic seperator and no leak, ~30 on the new 2.5 with the metal plate and i have a leak lol

mid-swap garage picture,
http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/1578/dscn0972y.jpg (http://img508.imageshack.us/i/dscn0972y.jpg/)

almost ready to drop in
http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/2072/dscn0973.jpg (http://img829.imageshack.us/i/dscn0973.jpg/)

happily in it's new home
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/66/dscn0975n.jpg (http://img822.imageshack.us/i/dscn0975n.jpg/)

http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/5699/dscn0976f.jpg (http://img827.imageshack.us/i/dscn0976f.jpg/)

yay stickers ( if you put them under the hood they add 7 hp instead of 5 lol)
http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/7704/dscn0980.jpg (http://img177.imageshack.us/i/dscn0980.jpg/)

post swap garage, I cleaned it up a LOT today but it's still messy
http://img217.imageshack.us/img217/4319/dscn0974u.jpg (http://img217.imageshack.us/i/dscn0974u.jpg/)

[httrdd]

So what hp/torque are you trying to make?

[Reason]

Sweet, did you drive yet?.....and

[Grafton]

So what hp/torque are you trying to make?
around 200 crank hp and the same torque wise

reason, yeah drove it home last night, and all over today. i want it broke in yesterday... :D

[StatGSR]

Now go break that thing in and show us a video of you beating the snot out of it! also, dyno sheet or it wasn't an improvement.... :grin:

[Grafton]

Now go break that thing in and show us a video of you beating the snot out of it! also, dyno sheet or it wasn't an improvement.... :grin:

I want a dyno sheet too...

with the 2.2 i managed a ~9.5 sec 0-60 on a level 65mpg road using a stoplight as my go signal, that was in the range for a stock 2.5L

i believe the biggest factor in my new 0-60 time will be my 1-2 shift 1st gear seems like i just have to shift right after getting it into gear, and that's without going WOT atm i'm trying to think of places i need to drive to get her broke in lol

[Soul Shinobi]

Barrage of questions (and comments) part two! :razz:

1. Why do you want to cut up that beautiful looking equal length (is it equal?) exhaust from your first post?
2. Do the older dual exhaust port 2.2L heads flow better than single port ones (both being phase I)?
3. Which yeah did they move to single port, was it '96, '97, or '98?
4. Are the dual and single port heads interchangeable (I know they are mechanically), or is there conflict with sensor types?
5. No surprise the oil separator plate is leaking if the sealant application was anything like what you did on the oil pan. The service manual shows you're supposed to fill those deep center groves, not avoid them. As for going around the bolts holes, they show to run the bead on the inside edge, but I did both sides of the bolt hole when I did mine.
6. Are you going to do a complete cost breakdown when this is all said and done including part sources (so we know when to fudge the numbers when we don't have 'friend pricing' on our oil pump)? Answer: Yes, yes you are. :grin:

[Grafton]

Barrage of questions (and comments) part two! :razz:

1. Why do you want to cut up that beautiful looking equal length (is it equal?) exhaust from your first post?
2. Do the older dual exhaust port 2.2L heads flow better than single port ones (both being phase I)?
3. Which yeah did they move to single port, was it '96, '97, or '98?
4. Are the dual and single port heads interchangeable (I know they are mechanically), or is there conflict with sensor types?
5. No surprise the oil separator plate is leaking if the sealant application was anything like what you did on the oil pan. The service manual shows you're supposed to fill those deep center groves, not avoid them. As for going around the bolts holes, they show to run the bead on the inside edge, but I did both sides of the bolt hole when I did mine.
6. Are you going to do a complete cost breakdown when this is all said and done including part sources (so we know when to fudge the numbers when we don't have 'friend pricing' on our oil pump)? Answer: Yes, yes you are. :grin:


yeap

1. didn't want the el sound, but now i think I can live with it if I quite it down some, I was going to make that OBX EL header into a UEL that mirrored my old header design

2. Not sure, logic says that they will plus it opened the door to a bunch of header options that i didn't have with the single port heads, and I didn't have to have any down time to port, polish and rebuild the heads

3. they went single in 96, 95 was the only year that second gen 2.2 had dual ports

4. the heads are seemly identical in every way except the exhaust ports, and there were no sensor problems

5. I redid the sealant on the oil pan so that it was done correctly, still, that hurt you cut me deep :smt022 lol

6. didn't have as many friend parts as you'd think but i'll do another cost breakdown after i get home and can look @ my excel spreadsheet with the numbers on it. spent well over a thousand, original budget was close to 700 lol

[Soul Shinobi]

Haha, I thought I was being harsh, sorry. Don't rush publishing the budget until you're all set with it. I think you did pretty good, I've come to expect the original budget to double. :razz:

[Grafton]

orignal budget 700, almost quadrupled it
http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/9352/budgete.jpg (http://img155.imageshack.us/i/budgete.jpg/)
* the shipping is so high because I had separate orders and had to ship the incorrect 2.2L pistons back.

the used shortblock was a big money sink seeing as it need new rings, pistons, crankshaft, and bearings

[httrdd]

No such thing as a budget build.

[JunkerXL]

lol +1




:smt020

[Soul Shinobi]

So basically your $120 block became a $1200+ block. Then you ended up spending the same on the top end too.
Not bad... obviously finding a block for a little more with better piston condition would have reduced some of the over run.
A fairly valuable lesson for anyone else thinking about doing this project. Its like they always say, "you have to spend some money to save some money."
also like I always say..."Subaru engines never need work... bolt dem damn heads on and lets make some power!" I also have about zero engine building experience.
However everything I have ever heard or seen, Subaru's run and make power no matter what the hell is going on.

EDIT: just to let you know, that was all typed by my friend Paige who's interested. :razz: I've rebuilt one engine myself, but hardly have the mental stamina for big projects like that.

[Grafton]

heads didn't really go crazy expense wise, the cams, cleaning, and valve job was expected, the need for new valves was the suprise

on the block i needed a crank and pistons the message there is get a short block that came out of a running car, and hasn't been dissembled...

[JunkerXL]

lol indeed. great work!




:smt020

[Grafton]

ok status update time,

so far she runs great
i have a small oil leak from the back of the motor
the pre 2500 hesitation is a lot less noticable with the 2.5 than the 2.2 but it's still the I'm price checking the replacement upgraded ecu from subaru
it's hard to start in the morning i believe its a fuel pressure thing, seems like the pressure leaks off the rail till the next morning going to get pressure gauge and check.
as i've said in other threads it's stupid loud imho and am planning exhaust work to rectify that

other than those minor issues i am a happy camper :D

atm it has ~240 miles on it 1/3 broke in yay

[Reason]

More about this upgrade ECU that you plan on getting.

[Soul Shinobi]

The oil leak could also be the wrist pin service hole. I think it has an o-ring, but I remember putting silicone around it anyway on mine. I mean, I guess it doesn't matter since you'll have to pull the motor to fix it anyway. Shouldn't be the rear main, I hope, it looked flush in the video you posted.

What are you running the 2.2L ECU on it?

I wonder if the high compression is harder on the starter, that would make sense.

[mike-tracy]

Cool read, I really need to do a spreadsheet for my build as well.
Costs just got outta control, for ex. I went through 3 cranks before finding one that didn't need machine work, needed to have the block & heads decked & polished for metal head gaskets, rebuilt the heads, new pistons, machine work to accommodate them, etc etc. I'm having fun, though, are you?

[httrdd]

^^^ Where is your members ride thread?

[mike-tracy]

^^^ Where is your members ride thread?
Haha, once I have the car running then I'll work on it. ;) So before snow is on the ground.

[Grafton]

mike-legacy I didn't have my block or heads docked/machined and I'm useing cometic hg's that even got retorqued lol risky risky

the leak is on the passenger of the rear for sure got the starting issue sorted, it was fuel pressure related, i pinched the big oring on the injector and it was leaking, so in the morning it would need to "prime" the fuel system.

reason:

i believe that i am suffering from the issue that was addressed in the following service bulletin:

Number 11-53-98, dated 1/5/99

HESITATION ON ACCELERATION - 11-53-98 (2/99)

Applicability: 97-98 Legacy, Impreza, and Forester Manual Transmission Vehicles with 2.5l and 2.2l engines.

In the event you encounter a customer complaint of a slight engine hesitation between 1500-2500 rpm's when the engine is cold or hot, perform the following

Eliminate all external influences, such as an incorrect or dirty air filter, loose or tracked intake duct, dirty fuel filter, low fuel pressure, PVC system, or low engine vacuum that would indicate an external leak or an internal engine component.

If all external components are confirmed to be operating within vehicle specifications, the hesitation may be caused by the ignition control logic in the ECM. Under certain low rpm driving patterns, the ignition control system can pick up engine vibrations through the knock sensor and may retard the ignition timing. This ignition timing is learned by the ECM and placed in memory. NOTE: This area of memory can not be viewed by using the Select Monitor. When the vehicle is driven uinder these conditions, the timing may be retarded and could cause the engine to hesitate on acceleration. To confirm this condition, road test the vehicle while viewing the Knock Sensor Signal on the Select Monitor. If you duplicate the hesitation, and the reading on the monitor is around -10 degrees, you will need to change the ECM to correct the concern. [my note: this is an enhanced ECM, not a replacement with the same component.

I've been logging my igntion timing and a few other specs and this is what the change over looks like:
below 2.5k spark advance is wacked out
LOAD_PCT(%) 54.1
RPM(/min) 2425
SPARKADV(°) 4
TP(%) 85.5
------------------

after 2.5k goes to "normal" or about quadripple what the freakout range is, plus you can feel the changeover
LOAD_PCT(%) 56.5
RPM(/min) 2550
SPARKADV(°) 16
TP(%) 84.3

[datdookie]

Im trying to get the cometic custom head gasket but the part number is now showing anything on their site, did you call them?

[Grafton]

Yeah you need to call them, for me it was 50ish each I don't figure prices would've changed that much

[Reason]

I had to call too for mine. And I was just upgrading. The 2.2 on their site was wrong for my EJ22E maybe it was for the turbo 22. Anyway its always a good idea to call a company if you can't go in person when ordering a custom part.

[datdookie]

cool thanks, tried calling them but was too late they were close at 5. Ill try tomorrow

[what huh]

any updates on the build

[Soul Shinobi]

Yeah, my friend's thinking about doing a similar build if he can make up his mind. :grin:

There's something exciting about NA builds. I'm curious what kind of economy it'd get too. The cams likely hurt but I bet the port/polish and manifold spacers help.

[Grafton]

a progress report eh, I'll give you an update... lol

apart from the small yet annoying oil leak the motor is running in top form, in about 200 miles it'll be time for the second oil change (3k)

the fuel economy is almost un-changed from the 2.2, granted i havn't had the chance for a full tank of highway running to get the pure interstate mpg's. I log my mpgs every time I fill up my data shows

18 months of data for the 2.2,

minimum - 18 mpg
average - 24 mpg
maximum - 31 mpg (i've hit 29-30 almost every tank that's been all interstate)

the 2.5 hybrid has been in for ~2months,
minimum - 18 mpg
average - 20.5 mpg
maximum - 26 mpg (only one interstate trip and it wasn't a full tank + following family who like to go 68-78-68... no steady crusing)

to be honest I feel need a longer 5th gear, even with the 3.9 fd, 70 mph crusing is at 3k rpms. If I got a 5th gear that was 70 and 2750 i'd bet i'd get better economy, for whatever reason i'll try to find a 6th gear if i cruse @ 75 for any amount of time

[Soul Shinobi]

How torquey does it feel daily driving compared to your old beast of a 2.2? Are you running the EL headers right now?

[Grafton]

How torquey does it feel daily driving compared to your old beast of a 2.2? Are you running the EL headers right now?

rediculously torquey :D

unlike the high power turbo guys where you get pushed back into the seat as the power comes on and stay pinned till off the gas, with my car if i go from crusing and slam the pedal it slams you back because of the torque but because it's not a big hp maker you dont get 'pinned' to the seat, you still feel it though and it is a huge smile generator

yes i am running the EL's, they are supposed to make a lot more power before the peak than UEL's can but the UEL's and the EL's peak within5-10 hp of each other (el making more power of course)

to be honest i want to dyno test el vs uel, but i dont have the money for a 3 way shoot-out (obx el vs brola uel vs obx modded to uel) i have a feeling a close ratio uel will provide the rumble i want and not loose out of a lot of non peak power that el's provide. the theory behind this is the closer to el you get the higher in the revs before exhaust pulses collide and the less rumble you get,

So in my world if you can get a uel ratio set to where pulse collision doesn't start till about 5700 you get a good power production and a rumble albiet not as rumbly as a brola but it'd make more power than a brola and on the flip side less power than an obx but nowhere near as 'honda-ish

[Soul Shinobi]

So you've got the Delta 2000 cams. Remind me, are those ones for HP or torque? I've love to head it with the EL headers, a little idle and drive-by vid would be sweet. :grin: I'm curious how Honda-ish a Subaru can be.

[Reason]

I want to hear about power and see dyno numbers! lol Your dyno sheet will determine if I will go forward with this build as well. I've been thinking about a boost build I was working on last year, or may keep the car as is and get something else.

[Grafton]

It's running 200 grind cams, torque cams, for the roller rocker 2.2Ls. I've been meaning to get the new exhaust video made it's really different than the way it sounded before.

reason send me $50 and you'll have a dyno chart lol

[Reason]

Justin if I could spare $50 I would! lol

[datdookie]

Hey Grafton sorry for all the questions i've been asking but your my only reference on this build. So i just got in my cometic head gasket part number H1631SPK040S.

Im seeing one thing that i think is wrong or maybe its not. The description on my receipt says
"SUB EJ22/25 Hybrid Motor 100mm. I never bored my block to 100mm, nor did i read any of your post saying that you did that either, so now im stuck.

I hope this is the right one.

[Grafton]

yeah the gasket bore is 100mm it's fine to use that way, it doesn't need to match the bore 100% just not be smaller than the bore

and don't worry lots of questions are good

[datdookie]

Alright sweet, thanks for the feed back, would love to get this done the end of this month but its christmas season and money has to go to gifts.

So close to getting this done...

Oh one more thing, did you upgrade your clutch or did you stay with stock oem?

[lord flashheart]

How much did this build cost?
What do you estimate the whp to be Assuming it was about 90whp before? Do you have any numbers? 0-60? 1/4 mile? Cars you have beat at the stop lights?

[Grafton]

budget is on page 4, total is just under 2700

I hit 111WHP with the 2.2, i figure around 155whp or 200-ish crank hp bc my 0-60 is close to the stock 2.0L wrx time

0-60:
2.2L ~9.5 seconds
2.5L ~6.25 seconds

no 1/4 mile time

and i dusted a ricer in an rx6, after he and his non-srt4 neon buddy did a ricer flyby. Did it to the next light without breaking the speed limit, 4 lane, 55 mph road ftw


public service announcement:


street racing is bad, mmmmm-ka

[lord flashheart]

Oh wow. That's pretty good for n/a.

[prodriver1]

looks to me like you didn't clock your rings rite on the pistons, the gaps should be a min of 45 deg from the thrust point and further 90 degrees from each gap.

[Grafton]

oh well, they move around once the get into the bore and the engine runs, judging by the fact I didn't burn oil on the first start up and havn't been since then they were close enough to where the book said to put them

[prodriver1]

oh well, they move around once the get into the bore and the engine runs, judging by the fact I didn't burn oil on the first start up and havn't been since then they were close enough to where the book said to put them
word. have you seen Omnimans 200whp B16 build? its all N/A and all honda parts build that ends up around 207whp. the build movie is long and boring at times but I have never seen more cheeky little tricks on engine building. highly recommended.

[LGT Kirby]

Very interested. I want to start building a replacement 2.5 for my LGT. I don't want to do turbo, to much hassel and lack of reliability. Would REALLY appriciate some dyno sheets, but I understand if times are tight.


Thanks,

Kirby

[Grafton]

high compression pistons would be better for you than doing a hybrid build, less wiring etc and more power

[LGT Kirby]

Yeah I'm just going to buy another block and build it on the side while I do all my suspension first.

[Grafton]

MPG update:

all highway tank 29.3 mpg, that's with a bunch of slow *2" of snow on the interstate* style driving

so it looks like my 2.5L gets about the same fuel economy as my old 2.2L

[Huffer]

wicked!

[Reason]

Are dyno numbers in the immediate future?

[Soul Shinobi]

Do we have to start donating to get a dyno chart? How many miles on the engine? Is it broken in yet?

[Grafton]

5k on the engine now, and still no dyno, I believe I'll be able to get one done here soon.
Tomorrow the lego and I are going to go to her birthplace, the SIA manufacturing plant and I'll get a nice tour of the place with the other tri-state folks

[Grafton]

I've been having cooling system issues for the last few weeks and all the tests I could run were inconclusive about the head gaskets till today, finally the napa block tester turned green when testing the bubbles from the overflow indicating an internal HG leak, luckily there seems to be no oil/water mixing happening.

yay weekend project

[httrdd]

Head gaskets were not done with the build or something else after the fact? That is the first thing I would look into doing when the engine is tore apart. You seem smart enough to have that done though.

[mike-tracy]

My friend reused his cometic hg's on his EG33 build 3 or so times. The HG's didn't blow, it was always something else. I'm interested to hear what cometic has to say about reusing them on a build that blew the HG's.

[Grafton]

Head gaskets were not done with the build or something else after the fact? That is the first thing I would look into doing when the engine is tore apart. You seem smart enough to have that done though.

They were new HG's but i did retorque them once, Cometic's are supposed to be reusable.


My friend reused his cometic hg's on his EG33 build 3 or so times. The HG's didn't blow, it was always something else. I'm interested to hear what cometic has to say about reusing them on a build that blew the HG's.

I'm not going to reuse them, and the new ones are getting a copper coating before they go in. As long as the surface are flat I don't expect another problem, I knew going in that this might happen because Cometic's don't like surface's that are "new" and have a reputation of not sealing that well on rough surfaces, copper spray fixes that issue.

I have a few other minor annoyances that need taken car of while I'm in there valve adjustments, and a small oil leak from the rear of the motor (stupid separator plate)

[Reason]

Then dyno numbers!

[DarkPhoenix]

Stage 1- Pull out engine and redo HGs
Stage 2 - Dyno run
Stage 3 - ???
Stage 4 - Profits!

[Grafton]

just tell me more about stage three and we're good, lol

EDIT: new headgaskets ordered,

to be repaired:
head gaskets
oil leak
inner tie rods
valve adjustment

possible:
frozen strut bolts

[DarkPhoenix]

just tell me more about stage three and we're good, lol


Ya know, the gnomes wouldn't tell me what stage 3 was. Something about corporate espionage or something.

[Grafton]

motor is out and heads are off cylinder #4 was the culprit, the head go to the machine shop tomorrow because they are a little warped

there was enough carbon build up in the motor that i might be running too high with the octane, going to see if she likes 89 or 91

[what huh]

there was enough carbon build up in the motor that i might be running too high with the octane, going to see if she likes 89 or 91

thats interesting, that a hi-comp motor might run just as good with less octane gas, cant wait to hear from you on how she runs with 89-91.

Fantastic tread by the way Grafton

[Grafton]

she's back together and should be back on the road tomorrow...

[httrdd]

Cool man.

[Grafton]

still running like a top, and on 89 octane!

when I was doing the head gaskets I felt that there was an unusual build up of carbon on the pistons, that can be caused by running with gas that has too high of an octane rating. so i went with a tank of 91 and it ran fine no pinging or other odd effects so I tried a tank of 89 and it still ran fine and seemed to put out the same amount of power. yay cheaper gas!

[LGT Kirby]

Still want that Dyno rating. Lol. Nice build.

[mike-tracy]

Still want that Dyno rating. Lol. Nice build.

How about we have a couple people paypal him. I'm down to donate $10 towards the dyno.

[Reason]

[quote="LGT Kirby":3sckhors]Still want that Dyno rating. Lol. Nice build.

How about we have a couple people paypal him. I'm down to donate $10 towards the dyno.[/quote:3sckhors]

I'm in, I'm dying to know...

[Grafton]

Finally got the new engine tested out, thanks to the folks @ J&S Dyno outside of Pittsburgh.

one note, the Dyno reads really low, they built up an EVO for a show running some crazy boost ~32+psi their mustang dyno showed it was pushing about 475hp to the wheels, but when they took it to Wyotech and put it on their dyno jet it pushed ~600hp at least this is what I was told.

Here's my dyno graph:
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/ (http://img202.imageshack.us/i/hicompressionhybrid.jpg/)

so I'm making 98 hp and 107ft-lbs at the wheels (5.2k rpm & 2.5k rpm) also my AFR is nice and stable so the 2.2L ecu is running things just fine

Moore performance did some baseline runs on a 2007 2.5i Impreza, which stock pushes 175hp and 169ft-lbs at the crank (6k rpm & 4.4k rpm respectively) here is the baseline run they did:

https://sl-i.net/FORUM/ (http://img13.imageshack.us/i/07stock25i.jpg/)

on the J&S dyno it reads 93hp and 98 ft-lbs at the wheels

so by doing the math very roughly it means I'm pushing ~183 hp and 183 ft-lbs at the crank

[Baddog]

Yikes don't stock 2.2's put out around 80-85 at elevation?

[Grafton]

That's why I posted the base line run from a stock 2.5i I figure a stock 2.2 would put about 65 or less on this dyno, but I'm making more horse power and torque at the wheels than a 175 hp impreza so even though the numbers are low the comparison still works

[Soul Shinobi]

I still can't get over your torque curve. :grin:

[Baddog]

What is the 0-60 with the High Comp build? And how does the power feel from the stock 2.2?

The reason I ask is because I plan on doing this fairly soon.

[Grafton]

The 0-60 is just over 6 seconds, and it feels a whole lot better than the 2.2l lots more power and the torque is awesome it peaks at 2500 and doesn't really drop of till 5200

[Baddog]

Any chance you have video where you do a pull? Yeah the 2.2 gets to 60 in mid 9's stock.

[LGTtoBE]

Graf!

I've been waiting to see this for what seems like forever! Though dyno graphs have never been a major interest of mine, I wanted to "see" the difference.
Thanks for posting!
I only hope my project continues to move forward and turns out as well as yours has.

(I'm still waiting to win the lottery and have unlimited time and financial resources)

[Perdue]

I wonder how much more hp a lightweight flywheel would actually free up? And then maybe some type of EM, even an Apexi AFC, to control the AFR a little better? Just thinking out loud. The torque curve looks amazingly fun...I'll have to get up that way for a ride-along before winter sets in.

[prodriver1]

I wonder how much more hp a lightweight flywheel would actually free up? And then maybe some type of EM, even an Apexi AFC, to control the AFR a little better? Just thinking out loud. The torque curve looks amazingly fun...I'll have to get up that way for a ride-along before winter sets in.
if you want torque dont get a light flywheel. I'm trying to find a heavier flywheel and a computer tune that will lower my rev limit down to 5500-5700 rpm to max the torque curve. I will trade lb/ft for hp any day :smt023

[Grafton]

I wonder how much more hp a lightweight flywheel would actually free up? And then maybe some type of EM, even an Apexi AFC, to control the AFR a little better? Just thinking out loud. The torque curve looks amazingly fun...I'll have to get up that way for a ride-along before winter sets in.
I doubt that there is much left there for tuning to squeeze out, but I'd love to see what lower drive train loss would do for me ( light weight flywheel and drives haft please ) and if your going to be in my neck of the woods let me know we'll figure something out



if you want torque dont get a light flywheel. I'm trying to find a heavier flywheel and a computer tune that will lower my rev limit down to 5500-5700 rpm to max the torque curve. I will trade lb/ft for hp any day :smt023


light weight flywheels and pulleys don't make HP or torque, and with a heavier flywheel you'll be increasing your drive train loss resulting in less power to the wheels, the less that's between engine and the wheels the better, more of the power gets to the road, also messing with your rev limit wont do squat to change the torque curve any, sure when you hit the rev limit you proposed your torque wont have dropped off but that's it, It be like never driving in those upper RPM ranges anyways, nothing changes about how the engine runs your just not spinning it as fast. to get more torque you need to do cams and headers at the least...

[Soul Shinobi]

Heavier engine parts means more drivetrain momentum, the only pluses are less speed lost going uphill, and launches (if you've got a tranny for it!).

[prodriver1]

I wonder how much more hp a lightweight flywheel would actually free up? And then maybe some type of EM, even an Apexi AFC, to control the AFR a little better? Just thinking out loud. The torque curve looks amazingly fun...I'll have to get up that way for a ride-along before winter sets in.
I doubt that there is much left there for tuning to squeeze out, but I'd love to see what lower drive train loss would do for me ( light weight flywheel and drives haft please ) and if your going to be in my neck of the woods let me know we'll figure something out



if you want torque dont get a light flywheel. I'm trying to find a heavier flywheel and a computer tune that will lower my rev limit down to 5500-5700 rpm to max the torque curve. I will trade lb/ft for hp any day :smt023


light weight flywheels and pulleys don't make HP or torque, and with a heavier flywheel you'll be increasing your drive train loss resulting in less power to the wheels, the less that's between engine and the wheels the better, more of the power gets to the road, also messing with your rev limit wont do squat to change the torque curve any, sure when you hit the rev limit you proposed your torque wont have dropped off but that's it, It be like never driving in those upper RPM ranges anyways, nothing changes about how the engine runs your just not spinning it as fast. to get more torque you need to do cams and headers at the least...
so why do off road trucks upgrade to heavier flywheels stating that they get more torque? and when people raise their rev limit they loose torque on dyno sheets that I have seen, why wouldent it?

[Grafton]

peak torque of ending torque? peak torque shouldn't change, and the heavier fly wheel is useful for off-roading because it helps resist changes in the drive-line speed so if the front tires were to hit a small burm or branch there is more "stored" energy in the heavier flywheel and the wheels are more likely to keep rolling over it rather than needing a blip of the gas to get over the obstacle, it also eases low rpm take offs because again the heavy fly-wheel resists slowing down

[Soul Shinobi]

^ That.

[Soul Shinobi]

Did you even get all the part in the first post on? I imagine fuelling would be holding you back, did you do a FPR? YES I AM DIGGING UP A 2 YEAR DEAD THREAD.

[86bratman]

I'm interested in impressions after driving it this long. How is it holding together, still happy on 89 octane, does it still have the smile factor?