lowering compression ej22

[darryl]

I want to lower the compression on my N/A ej22 i have had people tell me that all i would have to do is put a thicker gasket and it will work but i was wondering if their is more i should think about doing? I want to lower it about the same compression ratio as the turbo ej22 as i want to turbo my whole car out . . .I wish i could find a parts list to compare the two and see what i could to do but if i cant get it than anybodies advice is highly appreciated :lol:

[Huffer]

Yep, a slightly thicker Head Gasket will lower your compression.

[StatGSR]

ej22t internals... you should be able to get them second hand for well under $100

[anothernord]

ej22t internals... you should be able to get them second hand for well under $100

This; EJ22T stuff is easy to find. I'd say you would probably want to put some fresh rings on them though.

[darryl]

I have been thinking more about this haven't had time write anything because just being busy with other projects and studying a litte more on this topic. So i want to boost my car with about 10 to 15 pounds of boost. I at least want to get about 220hp to the wheels or a litte more but no more than 270. Now I have found cometic head gaskets seem to be the way to go but is just replaceing my head gaskets gona be enoff to lower my compression to where i need to be to get the horse power that i want or should i look geting wiseco pistons to? I really dont want to send a whole lot of money on this but if it's gona be better for me to get new pistons then i will.

[jey]

It's going to be better to get stronger pistons.

[darryl]

The pistons are already stong enoff to handle a turbo power I just want to know how low i need to go with the compression to make the horse power that i want? but i do appericate the input.

[mike-tracy]

I wonder if ej22t heads line up with the 22e block (ie. coolant and oil passages) close enough to work. Assuming it does, that would drop your compression even further (slightly). Think the stock EJ22T has a compression ratio of 7.8 or 8.0:1, so with the pistions and turbo heads you should be right around there with the thicker ej22t head gaskets. Plus you'd have the correct profile cams for what you're looking to do.

You know who'd be a good person to ask? Matt Monson on Nasioc. He's something of an expert on these hybrid builds.

[darryl]

I'll be sure to do that than.

[jey]

The pistons are already stong enoff to handle a turbo power I just want to know how low i need to go with the compression to make the horse power that i want? but i do appericate the input.

Not sure what you mean by this - you get more power with MORE compression, whether it be in the form of engine compression or forced induction.

[darryl]

I just want to know how low I should take my engine compression so my engine can handle the forced induction compression that I want to put in it. It's not about stronger piston because as far as I know the 1gen turbo legacy piston were made with the same metal and forced the same way but it more about the shape of the piston to help lower my compression so my engine can handle the forced induction. In other word will an 8:1 compression ratio be good with 10 to 15 pounds of boost or will a 8:6 compression ratio do just fine with that amount. I hope you are able to get what I am trying to say I am sorry if I am little confusing.

[lord flashheart]

you know that whole "ej22e-ej25d" hybrid hi-comp motor? (ej25d block+ej22e heads=hi comp) well if u reverse that with a ej22e block and ej25d heads it will: A. flow better than your 22e heads, and B will lower the compression to about 8:1 which is plenty low enough for a turbo motor. however keep inmind 2 things. compression is only part of it, you still have to concider cylinder walk, because its an open deck motor, also as far as boost goes the general rule is: if its tuned right, it wont detonate, if it doesnt detonate, SHIT DONT BREAK. there is a guy on nasioc who is running like 28Lbs of boost on a EJ25D and doesnt break shit cuz its tuned well.

[lord flashheart]

ive never herd of a 8:6 compression.. the ej22e (if i remember right) has 9.5:1 which would not support 10-15lbs. i wouldnt recomend more than 5-6lbs of boost on a stock ej22 (and only 2-3 lbs if its ur daily driver). but 8:1 is a good compression ratio for turbo charging. the sti has 8.2:1 compression ratio with 14lbs of boost thats IMO ideal for daily driving... also, i know a tuner who has turboed a few stock ej22es and he told me the ej22e running stock comp, on 2-3lbs will haul ass. another thing to keep inmind is if u go over a couple pounds of boost u will need bigger injectors and a good tune. the stock injectors have a "margin of safety" on fuel out put, so u can run a couple of pounds and get away with it, but if u run 15 lbs on stock injectors, when u floor it, the injectors cant keep up with the air and the AFR gets really lean, it pre detonates and u will break pistons and rods and all that fun stuff.

on a lighter note, since the EJ motors are like legos u can get the stock exhaust manifold, up pipe, turbo (a Td04 from a stock 2.0 2001-2005 wrx not the VF39 from the 06+ 2.5 wrx), down pipe, intercooler etc, for way cheap. i bet u could do it and put down alot of power for 1000 bucks.

have u considered the transmission in this?

[anothernord]

^^ 5-6 PSI is perfectly fine for daily driving, especially on the EJ22, which is much more boost-friendly than the 2.5.

Plenty of people run more than 6 psi on their stock 2.2 and 2.5's, it's just a matter of fuel and timing control.

[lord flashheart]

Yes I know that. However, the people I know who have been running 6 pound have only had for about 10k ( and that's not enough to determine reliability) so I can't speak for the reliability. A couple of years ago I read some threads about this on 2.5rs.com (I think) saying how there was a guy with a turbo on a 22 at 7-8 lbs and he had blown it his advise 5 lbs and the tuned I mentioned above told me 5-6 is the most he would run.. Now I know this is one case but I rather tell him a safe number and not blow his motor than to comeback saying 'I ran 7 lbs and blew my motor.' Especially when I don't know how many miles are on the motor in question or if he beats the help out of motors. but I do know the stock injectors only have about 10-15% margins so u don't lean it out and 5-6 lbs is getting close to that. It only takes half a second of being lean to break rods. And I agree its all about the timing and fuel. That's how the guy with the 25D pulled it off with high boost.

[darryl]

lord flashheart you know that whole "ej22e-ej25d" hybrid hi-comp motor? (ej25d block+ej22e heads=hi comp) well if u reverse that with a ej22e block and ej25d heads it will: A. flow better than your 22e heads, and B will lower the compression to about 8:1 which is plenty low enough for a turbo motor.
Now if i use the ej25d heads then their would be no reason to get dipped pistons then? Which would be better dipped pistons or the ej25d head? I know for sure one of things I am kind of sold on doing but wish I didn't have to spend the money on is new rods but figured their gona take more of beating then then the pistons so i would like to have some good ones that can handle it you know. I want to build it right. I don't carry how long it takes because it siting in my garge anyways.

[lord flashheart]

There isn't a set right and wrong way to do things, its really comes down to what you want to achieve and your budget. The ej22 is a very stout motor as it sits. It's simple, efficent, and inexpensive. Its one of my favorite motors (along with the 22RE,5fe,and chev 350/ls1).
But Anyways... i am actually in the middle of building a forced induction 2.2 hybrid. I won't say more than that because it going to be a suprise..
Personally, I would just put on the 2.5 heads on your stock 22e. (preferably the ej251) because they flow better than STi heads, they are sohc so you should be able to use the same timing belt, and they make lots of performance cams for those heads. And if anything happens to the lower end of motor its super cheap to rebuild, or replace.

Also if you go with 25 heads you may want to consider getting heads off a turbocharged car, that way you don't have to try to plumb the oil lines to and from your turbo. I've never done it but I've heard putting in oil lines for the turbo can be a pain in the Dick.

After sourcing and pricing parts to make a turbo kit I found its cheaper to buy a turbo motor with a spun rod bearing and putting your short block under it and slap a manual boost controller on it. Then you have all the parts you need. And if you stay low boost ( under 5psi) you can use your 22 injectors and then you should be able to ( in theory ) drive without a tune until you can get it tuned. But the problem I've run into is finding a opensource for our ecus. How ever the info I've found on driving with out a tune has been irregular and non consistent. Some tunes say yes if the boost is low enough, others say it won't run..

[lord flashheart]

Also if u do use 22 injectors and go over 5psi you should invest in a air fuel ratio gauge so you don't lean out. The tuner should make sure that everything is good in a/f ratio but its still good to keep an eye on it. Like I said before leaning out can blow up your motor real.quick.

[darryl]

Thank for all the info. Your filling me up with a lot things to think about I appreciate it. I was looking up on what cars the ej25d came in I found it came in the 96 thought 98 legacy gt, 98 impreza, and 98 forester. That does that sound about right. What are your sugestion on where I should buy them at? because I don't want to get taken I want to make sure that I am geting the right part. If I go looking at a junk yard I want to make sure I am geting off the right car.

[lord flashheart]

Yes the 25D was in those cars till 00 I believe. You may want to check with your local subaru engine builders, they probably have a manufactured set they will sell you for pretty cheap. I haven't look to see how much it would cost to have a junk yard set remand. Feel free to PM me if you need info and I maybe willing to show you some pictures of my top secret ej20k/ej22e hybrid build I'm working on.

[StatGSR]

honestly, build a turbo kit for less than a grand (its not that hard people), get a rising rate FPR and run it at 5-8lbs. if and when the engine pops, its all of what? $200, and 5 hours to put in a new one? you can start by buying a spare 2.2 and setting it in the garage.

There is a guy i know on my local forum. he has had a 2.2T engine sitting in his garage for over a few years now waiting to put it in. why has he been waiting? because he cannot kill his stock 2.2. his car has been running 10lbs with no EM besides a rising rate FPR making over 200whp for that long. he has killed like 2 turbo's yet his engine is still fine.

btw, keep in mind that swaping heads will create headaches in the wiring department, also you will need to get everything else that attaches to the top of the new heads as your IM and what not will not bolt up.