Squishy brake pedal

[TotalLifeForever]

So maybe 4 or 5 days ago me and my friend changed the pads on my front wheels because they were beyond worn. So we lowered the car with everything all bolted up right and my brake pedal was mushy. We thought that hey maybe with time it should get better right? well it didnt. So we decided to bleed the system and we did all four corners and its still all mushy :neutral: Any hints for us? I'm thinking about taking it to a brake place when I get paid to have them fix it but I'm sure if we did it ourselves I'd save some money. So any ideas fellas?

[Huffer]

Rebleed.

[jey]

What brake fluid and pads are you using? Just how mushy is it - does it feel different or does it feel dangerous? Different fluid and pads do change the feel of the brake pedal.

[chuckthefuk]

you can always try these and never deal with another person again.

http://www.speedbleeder.com/

-Chuck

[Huffer]

^^ until they rust into your caliper...
(which has happened to me)

[TotalLifeForever]

I bought brand new duralast pads from autozone, And I'm not too sure what kind of brake fluid we were using, but I do know that the fluid in my car was like reeeally bad lol. So I'm thinking just get all new fluid and rebleed it so its totally fresh? I'll try that and see what happens. But like as I depress the pedal it brakes a very small amount and it only really like grabs hard if i push it all the way to the floor. Its not dangerous to drive with I don't think but you certainly have to pay attention lol

[mike-tracy]

It also sounds like you haven't bedded in the pads properly.

There's several techniques to do it, but I always find a straight, empty road where you can see anyone coming for miles, accelerate to 60, slam on the brakes to 10, and repeat at least 6 times. When you've gotten the pedal a little mushy due to the heat, just drive normally home, letting the brake system cool down.

[02_Legacy]

It also sounds like you haven't bedded in the pads properly.

There's several techniques to do it, but I always find a straight, empty road where you can see anyone coming for miles, accelerate to 60, slam on the brakes to 10, and repeat at least 6 times. When you've gotten the pedal a little mushy due to the heat, just drive normally home, letting the brake system cool down.
Be carefull when doing this otherwise you may end up with a warped rotor. I recommend driving about a mile inbetween stops to dissipate the heat.

Edit: also, to me at least, it doesn't sound like your problem is with the fluid because changing pads doesn't have anything to do with the fluid. Just be sure that there are not any little pin holes in your lines anywhere.

[ProjectLGT97]

Sounds to me like you still have air in the lines. Are you using a clear hose attached to your bleeder? What was your process for bleeding? Was it: Open the valve, Pedal down, close valve, let the pedal back up?

[mike-tracy]

[quote="mike-tracy":2esxmplz]It also sounds like you haven't bedded in the pads properly.

There's several techniques to do it, but I always find a straight, empty road where you can see anyone coming for miles, accelerate to 60, slam on the brakes to 10, and repeat at least 6 times. When you've gotten the pedal a little mushy due to the heat, just drive normally home, letting the brake system cool down.
Be carefull when doing this otherwise you may end up with a warped rotor. I recommend driving about a mile inbetween stops to dissipate the heat.
[/quote:2esxmplz]

Actually bedding them in as I described prevents warped rotors. Here's the info (from the stickies):

http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_wa ... disk.shtml (http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml)

[02_Legacy]

Actually bedding them in as I described prevents warped rotors. Here's the info (from the stickies):

http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_wa ... disk.shtml (http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml)

That site proves what I just said, it said "warped rotors" (which the site says do not exist, I say BS) is actually pad material caked on the rotor from excessive temps, which is caused by intense braking. So no matter what I would allow time to cool inbetween each stop.

[mike-tracy]

I highlighted the part I was talking about (from the link I provided). Where do you get that you need to cool down the rotors (for "a mile" according to you) in between each braking attempt? I've never heard of that. Stoptech says using normal acceleration in between each braking attempt is fine. Only after the series of 60-10mph slowdowns does one cool down the brake rotors to air temperature.


PREVENTION
There is only one way to prevent this sort of thing - following proper break in procedures for both pad and disc and use the correct pad for your driving style and conditions. All high performance after market discs and pads should come with both installation and break in instructions. The procedures are very similar between manufacturers. With respect to the pads, the bonding resins must be burned off relatively slowly to avoid both fade and uneven deposits. The procedure is several stops of increasing severity with a brief cooling period between them. After the last stop, the system should be allowed to cool to ambient temperature. Typically, a series of ten increasingly hard stops from 60mph to 5 mph with normal acceleration in between should get the job done for a high performance street pad. During pad or disc break-in, do not come to a complete stop, so plan where and when you do this procedure with care and concern for yourself and the safety of others. If you come to a complete stop before the break-in process is completed there is the chance for non-uniform pad material transfer or pad imprinting to take place and the results will be what the whole process is trying to avoid. Game over.

[02_Legacy]

I guess the only difference between my thinking and your thinking is the time to let the pads cool. You (that article) says normal acceleration will cut it. I say BS once more... but that article doesn't believe that rotors can become warped in the first place anyways so whatever.

[ProjectLGT97]

The article is correct. When rotors "warp" it is really high spots created by excess braking material. This is why you can resurface the rotors.

[TotalLifeForever]

When we bled the lines I was in the car and I would pump the brakes several times and hold them, and my friend would open the line and let some fluid shoot out into a cup. Repeat several times for each corner. But pads not embedded properly? Tomorrow I'll try the stopping method to see if that works :eek: thanks for the help though everyone

[subyfreak619]

remember to start at the farthest point from the master cylinder in your case the right rear , then the left rear, then RF then LF. but use a turkey baster to get as much of the nasty rank fluid out of the reservoir first. and keep an EYE :shock: on the brake fluid level, BC i suspect you are sucking in air in between top offs :wink:

[ProjectLGT97]

remember to start at the farthest point from the master cylinder in your case the right rear , then the left rear, then RF then LF. but use a turkey baster to get as much of the nasty rank fluid out of the reservoir first. and keep an EYE :shock: on the brake fluid level, BC i suspect you are sucking in air in between top offs :wink:

This^^^

And also try bleeding them the way I mentioned before. Its worth a shot!

1: depress pedal
2: Open valve
3: Close valve
4: Lift Pedal
5: Repeat!

[TotalLifeForever]

I think were gonna rebleed em today. I'll keep all this advice in mind :grin: If we do I'll report back with da resultzz

[ProjectLGT97]

Dont for get to use a clear hose over the bleeder valve so you can see the air!

[TotalLifeForever]

Problem has officialy been solved my friends. So me and my friend tried bleeding it again and it didnt work lol. Sooooo Yesterday I took it to a brake shop and they found the culprit.. My front caliper was messed up lol. So they did a full bleed and caliper rebuild and my legacy is GOOD TO GO! :grin: and she stops better than before now :razz:

[Huffer]

So your caliper piston wasn't working? You should have seen that by looking at the worn pads and rotors... >:<

[TotalLifeForever]

Well my rotors looks fine and we just thought my pads were worn down from age. Its alll still a learning process for me lol. Seems like theres always something new to learn about cars, I like that tho

[loganmossmusic]

So a caliper rebuild fixed your problems? My brakes have been doing the same thing and I have been thinking about rebuilding it, I just dont know if it will solve the problem.

[Baddog]

I was reading about how to bleed brakes in Subaru's the other day. Saw this thread.

They say the bleed order is different. It goes as follows.

Passenger side Front
Driver side Rear
Driver side Front
Passenger side Rear.

[ericem]

I was reading about how to bleed brakes in Subaru's the other day. Saw this thread.

They say the bleed order is different. It goes as follows.

Passenger side Front
Driver side Rear
Driver side Front
Passenger side Rear.

Yup!

https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2011/01/brakebleedordergif-1.jpg

[Baddog]

I was reading about how to bleed brakes in Subaru's the other day. Saw this thread.

They say the bleed order is different. It goes as follows.

Passenger side Front
Driver side Rear
Driver side Front
Passenger side Rear.

Yup!

https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2011/01/brakebleedordergif-1.jpg


This also makes me go...WTF where is the master cylinder at then