ej20t or ej25???

[03LegacyL]

i have a ej25 sohc in car now and found a ej20t for pretty cheap. but i wasnt sure of a few things. should i go with the ej20t will transmission i have now bolt up fine, or should i just go with a newer ej25 dohc. for the cost difference im leaning towards the ej20t... but am i selling my self short, the difference in price is around 1200-1500 bux. any advice would be greatful! :smt017

[massdrewski]

will it bolt up? yes. I personaly do not know the power ratings of your transmission. but, If you were to check some threads at nasioc.com or RS25.com you should find some answers. good luck with the swap! and I know that you are not the first or last to do this one.

[03LegacyL]

ok so they will bolt up, thanks for that. now isnt it possible to just upgrade clutch and flywheel and so forth to handle more horsepower or is it a better idea to just to switch out the tranny?......


:razz:

[03LegacyL]

and before i forget, what about engine mounts... will the ej20t drop right down like it was oem or what mods would i have to do, besides the ecu and body harness?

[mike-tracy]

Broski, check out the stickies at the top of the "swaps and conversions" page.

For example, viewtopic.php?f=31&t=3347 (https://sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=3347)
and http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=386462

[lord flashheart]

My two cents. I would go 2.5... the lag on 2.0 leaves much to be desired. And you can do what I did. I payed the local subaru engine builders to build me a 2.5 hybrid, hi-compression engine that is plug and play with my ecu and wiring harness so its easy to pass emissions,and it only cost me $1350 parts and labor. The motor puts out a little more than the 2.0 and I have more low end so your 0-60 is slightly faster than the 2.0 wrxs... and as far as the trans goes. Stock trans will hold just fine if you set it up right. See when you have that much power and you floor it, something had to give. The awd won't let the tires give and if your clutch doesn't give, your trans most likely will. Your best bet is to go with a soft compound clutch and a super high pressure pressure plate so once the clutch grabs it won't let go but if you over do it the clutch plate will give so you don't blow your trans.

[03LegacyL]

well this car is my daily driver. i plan on building another one down the road later, that one to have some serious fun with. but for now im just trying to hook up my daily driver. i found a ej20t with tranny and ecu for 1200.00. but if you can break the list down on how you got that hybrid for only 1300 or so... like for example where you bought the parts and where you found the ej25 for so cheap. i just stared my hunt and its usually around 2,500 or so... for the ej25 dohc, and anywhere from 900 to 1200 for ej20t.

ive only been with you guys a day or so and ive learned tons..... thanks! :smt026

[lord flashheart]

Are you talking about a EJ255/EJ257 swap? Another thing to consider is its not just the cost of the motor. You got to consider what else you will need. Does it have a turbo? Or a inter xooler. Or ecu or exhaust .. and all the information out there makes turbo engine swaps super easy. But I can tell you from experience, that it takes more than a wink and a smile. And if its your first subaru motor swap I would strongly discourage a turbo swap. Turbo engine swaps complicate the shit out of a swap. When I said 2.5 I was referring to a ej253/EJ251 N/A hybrid motor. My n/a 4cylinder makes 220chp. And although the Ej205 is rated at 227chp I find that the real world power is more like 200chp. And all I did was hook up the old wiring harness and ecu. The ej257 is a VERY complicated swap. The ej205 is also a complicated swap. I Highly highly recommend a n/a hi-compression 2.5 swap, you have a NEW motor..0 miles, with a warranty vs. A motor that some punk kid beat the S out of for 50-90k and generally speaking n/a is cheaper on gas, more reliable, cheaper parts, n/a can go longer between oil changes, less maintenance, and to be 100% honest, 200hp n/a is more fun and usually faster that 200 turbo horsepower. Because there is no lag. I've done some swaps and I tell newbies all the time. Do an n/a swap first. Even if you just take your motor out and break it down to a long block and put it back in. So you can familiarize your self with swapping motors before you do a turbo swap. The people who say its easy are the gurus who know tons about it and have done it a bunch of times. But for a first timer. It's hard.

[mike-tracy]

Expect your car to be down for a couple weeks to a couple months (for your first couple of times) as well.

[lord flashheart]

Also passing emission with a turbo motor is a major hurtle as well. Where as a n/a swap runs on the same ecu. So the computer has no clue that anything is different. Making it a piece of cake to pass emissions.

Ps welcome to sl-I. It was the first subaru forum I joined and is certainly my fav. Everyone here is super rad. Except for mike Tracy. He's a Dick... lol just kidding mike is rad too and he knows a lot.. and yeah you will learn a lot. If your ever looking for technical information it would be wise to make a account on nasioc. And also if you go nasioc then forums then chapters you can find people in your area, who hold meets and can help you ons swap if needed. If your looking for me stop by the rocky mountain impreza owners club forum. I'm on all the time there.

[mike-tracy]

. Everyone here is super rad. Except for mike Tracy. He's a Dick... lol just kidding mike is rad too and he knows a lot.. and yeah you will learn a lot.

Hahaha. :grin:

Flashheart is quite the character too, but in a good way.

[03LegacyL]

well to be honest... im having a shop my cousin runs to do my legacy l... i will buy my first actual project car shortly with in the next year or so to mess with myself. i have two kids so i cant have my car be down for a few weeks are more. so my first subie is being done by a shop. so its done in no time. im just doing research right now and getting use the subaru before i actually jump into doing it myself. before this i had just another dime a dozen Honda civic with a gsr swap and type r lsd tranny. but for the research ive done.... my love for honda has faded and my love for subaru has taken over by far. i am most definitely going to get another legacy if not impreza and mod the hell out of it. so thank you guys so much for all the info and keep it coming!!!!!

[lord flashheart]

I don't want to sound like an ass or Fuck or whatever, but I'm going to be blunt with you, Just so you know even the best shops will still take at least a week to do a swap. The wiring alone takes a professional at least a few days. I just think your under estimating this swap. A Honda swap can be done in a weekend. Subarus are a different beast. The motor that is in your car is perfectly capable of making the power and more reliably as well. Personally I think your making a poor choice. Alot of newbies want to do the turbo swap and I've discovered its mostly because they want to say "i put a wrx motor in my car" or "yeah its turbo'ed". Just because everyone think n/a is boring. Stop chasing unicorns and look at this from a logical and objective stand point.

What are the goals?
Reliable
Quick and easy
220chp
Minimum down time.
Inexpensive

I just told u you could have more power from a more reliable motor with a warranty, that would cost less and be done in one day. And you wouldn't have to worry about emissions and your car would beat most wrxs even tho your car is heavier.

Instead you want the motor that was beat up by some kid, doesn't have a warranty, that does spool until 4200 rpms, will cost more, (up front and in long run) is less reliable ( especially for a daily driver) will take a couple weeks to swap, even by a pro, and cost of the motor, you need a lot of other things like exhaust, a hood with a scoop, ecu, turbo and other components to make it work with your car. and on top of all that. You can't pass emissions. You only have 3 options for passing emissions btw.. move to a county that doesn't have emissions, swap the motor back every year so you can pass, or use the stock ecu and modify it to run a turbo engine and even then that's a lot of work, will likely run like shit and is still a long shot on emissions cuz, turbo engines don't burn as clean.

[lord flashheart]

Sorry to sound like a Dick, btw. That wasn't the intent. I know regardless of what I say you will probably do the swap. I'm just telling you from personal experience, A LOT of newbies try these swaps and find themselves in over there heads. Good luck.

[Reason]

For what you are trying to do I would stay n/a 2.5 unless you have a second car. How many stories do you hear about turbo builds failing either during or after the swap? Are turbo builds never completed. Everytime I talk to Tom at Wicked Innovation he has a couple WRX's and STi's in there for blown motors, trannys or turbo's.

I would do a turbo build only if I had another car on the road that was reliable and ready to bring my ass to work every day. I have a 2.2 with "stage1" cams, bolt one and some suspension work. This car is a lot more fun to drive now then this past summer. And I will be more fun when I complete it, and I wont need boost to put a smile on my face.

[lord flashheart]

That^

[03LegacyL]

good point... but my main problem is that i couldnt find parts for my motor so i knew subarus most popular car was the impreza and parts would be everywhere. was the main reason i even wanted to do a swap.... now if you guys can point me in the right direction like i believe you are. just help me find parts for my stock motor and i shall rebuild her. like i said befor i plan to actually get a project car, to have fun with. so i wouldnt mind a n/a sohc for a dd. but i do want her to be fun to drive.

[02_Legacy]

just help me find parts for my stock motor and i shall rebuild her. like i said befor i plan to actually get a project car, to have fun with. so i wouldnt mind a n/a sohc for a dd. but i do want her to be fun to drive.
If you are looking to get more power out of your stock motor the best way is cams, full header back exhaust, intake, and pp6 or equivelent. It will cost no more than a swap and way more reliable provided you can tune it right. That is my recomendation.

[lord flashheart]

I'll talk to my buddy at metric motor, who built mine and ill get a list of parts you will need. The motor in your car is the ej251 I believe which is the same one I bought. And so the parts list will be pretty short (performance head gaskets, cams, etc). I bet my buddy at metric could send you a built long block and you just send back the core charge so you could have your car done in one day. Yours will probably be cheaper than mine because I had to buy a block, heads etc. You already got that so it won't be much.

[03LegacyL]

ok beautiful, but that was really my first problem i ran across. now will a legacy gt exhaust fit on my L model or will i have to make a custom exhaust. now hopefully headers and such are interchangeable. you guys are right about the subarus being another beast. theres no doubt about that. :smt023

[Reason]

If you need Genuine Subaru parts go to Subarupartsforyou.com and if you want go fast parts pm me what you need.

[03LegacyL]

now here is a good question... so can cams, pistons, rods and so forth be switch between ej25 motors or is it all independent?

[03LegacyL]

well im going to call it a night and watch a movie with the mrs. email mail me at anytime @ addanotherteardrop@gmail.com... it goes straight to my blackberry.
thanks again guys.... look forward to talking somemore.
:smt006

[lord flashheart]

Some cams are interchangeable and pistons and rods and cranks are for the most part. But keep in mind when you mess with that stuff you are changing compression ratios and such. Subarus are like legos they will go together and most work with each other but sometimes just because the parts are compatible doesn't mean that is the most efficient or to get optimum performance. And again for the best subaru technical data browse thru nasioc. Almost everything you can think of has been done or at least attempted. You want info on swapping your STi engine and trans to a brat? It's been done.you want to build a hi compression motor using only parts available in a common junk yard? Yep been done. You want to know if a STi crank will work in a ej22t? They have info on that.

[lord flashheart]

If you need Genuine Subaru parts go to Subarupartsforyou.com and if you want go fast parts pm me what you need.


Pssssh.. what do you know about going fast?
Hahaha just messing with you....please don't ban me...

[Reason]

I don't, have you read my sig? Lol

[lord flashheart]

STi guys ain't got nothin on 105whp!

[StatGSR]

My n/a 4cylinder makes 220chp.

BS. seriously, how did you gain this 55hp NA and where is your dyno plot? a franken motor with cams and no em does not make that kinda power period.

so until you show me a dyno plot, stop saying it makes more power than a stock wrx...

[lord flashheart]

Its hardly a "franken motor". It's a high compression ej25 hybrid with custom cams, pistons, etc. and I believe they did a port and polish as well It's actually the same motor they build for small planes. And it was built by the best subaru engine builders in the state.(possibly the country) its not just a motor I put together with some parts I had laying around. I don't know every part that went into it. But I told them I wanted a 220chp, under $1500, n/a, that was plug and play with my car. He told me that they build this motor for air planes and it fits that criteria. The dyno cost is super expensive if its not in the car. So once its running I will take it to the dyno and I'm estimating about 40hp for mechanical drag. So if its 180whp I think that would be right in that area. Also keep in mind this is with a different intake, headers, catless, and probably a ej25 ecu and injectors.

[lord flashheart]

Ps ill have it running by Wednesday. And I'll bet you it will make 220.

[anothernord]

Forget N/A, get some air blown into your engine. It's fun.

[Reason]

Ps ill have it running by Wednesday. And I'll bet you it will make 220.

I'm going to have to quote this and see your guys if so :grin:

[lord flashheart]

Metric motors is the bomb. Infact when I was looking to get a motor rebuilt I discovered the dealer doesn't actually rebuild them. Instead They send it to metric motors, and metric rebuilds it. They build 800 HP SUBARU motors all the time. The long block they built for my outback is the same long block they build to handle 800hp. Granted my motor puts out a humble 300 because I don't want to fry the trans and I don't want to go crazy.. but yeah they are freaking awesome.

[lord flashheart]

Ps ill have it running by Wednesday. And I'll bet you it will make 220.

I'm going to have to quote this and see your guys if so :grin:
This also depends on if my outbackXT is running. As I need a car. And my gf would kill me if I took the motor out of the only running car I have. The outback and my truck are both down.

[Reason]

Im lost now, I didn't noticed you had an XT. What is the car withtl the high comp build going on?

[StatGSR]

^ yea your not the only one that doesn't understand what is going on...

<--still doesn't believe in the mythical 220chp $1500 NA EJ25 with no EM. and if the mythical creature does exist, can't imagine how it is only $1500 and if that is anywhere near the "anybody can get it for that much" price tag...

[RS MN]

^ yea your not the only one that doesn't understand what is going on...

<--still doesn't believe in the mythical 220chp $1500 NA EJ25 with no EM. and if the mythical creature does exist, can't imagine how it is only $1500 and if that is anywhere near the "anybody can if for that much" price tag...


+1. if its under $1500, its a way better option than a WRX swap. ill be watching this to see the results.

[lord flashheart]

Yeah I have a outbackxt, it spun a rod bearing so I had, the same company built me a ej257 long block with forged internals, acl race bearing, custom wisco pistons, cams etc.
And to be honest I really don't care if you believe me. And you act like I'm the first one to do this I know 2 other locals who have this motor, infact when my outback was running I raced a guy with a 1994 legacy turbo and he swapped his ej22t out for it.. I won, but he gave my car a pretty good run for its money. Later I talked to him and he told me about the built 2.5 he stuck in it and that's where I started entertaining the idea. I was also curious about the ej25/ej22 hybrid hi comp, so I asked metric about it,and he told me that he could build me a 2.5 n/a that would stomp the 2.2/2.5 hybrid. And he has always impressed me before so I told him to build it. Usually when I race a 2.0 wrx I smoke them, where as this legacy put up a dang good fight. It was closer to beating me than most of the 2.0 wrx and it made one bell of a good sound. Btw the n/a motor is going in a 1995 legacy sedan. See my rally car project thread in members rides. The reason I see people not doing this swap is because everyone wants to say 'I put a wrx engine in my car' everyone is so obsessed with turbos that people never look at other alternatives and no one has any faith in n/a.
Is it so hard to believe that a engine that does 175hp at 10:1 can make 220ish HP at 14:1 with headers, port and polish, intake, injectors etc? Well wat ever..

[RS MN]

And to be honest I really don't care if you believe me. And you act like I'm the first one to do this I know 2 other locals who have this motor, infact when my outback was running I raced a guy with a 1994 legacy turbo and he swapped his ej22t out for it.. I won, but he gave my car a pretty good run for its money. Later I talked to him and he told me about the built 2.5 he stuck in it and that's where I started entertaining the idea. I was also curious about the ej25/ej22 hybrid hi comp, so I asked metric about it,and he told me that he could build me a 2.5 n/a that would stomp the 2.2/2.5 hybrid. And he has always impressed me before so I told him to build it. Usually when I race a 2.0 wrx I smoke them, where as this legacy put up a dang good fight. It was closer to beating me than most of the 2.0 wrx and it made one bell of a good sound. Btw the n/a motor is going in a 1995 legacy sedan. See my rally car project thread in members rides. The reason I see people not doing this swap is because everyone wants to say 'I put a wrx engine in my car' everyone is so obsessed with turbos that people never look at other alternatives and no one has any faith in n/a.
Is it so hard to believe that a engine that does 175hp at 10:1 can make 220ish HP at 14:1 with headers, port and polish, intake, injectors etc? Well wat ever..

its not that i dont believe it cant be done, i know its been done many many times.
the thing i find hard to believe is that it can be *easily* done for under $1500 and without EM. also, to the whole wanting to be able to say "i put a wrx engine in my car", i'm the opposite (to a point, i'd like me an ez30r or eg33). i'd rather build up a powerplant than just swap one in. i'd really like to have a >200HP NA EJ, the power curve would be so much smoother and more usable than a turbo setup. but when you compare prices for building up an NA engine, to turboing the engine, (with the same, somewhat low HP goals like 220CHP) the turbo option usually comes out cheaper and easier. i really do want to see some dyno sheets on your engine though, and a parts list as well. also, what EJ25 are you speaking of that has 175CHP stock? the EJ251 from the SOHC RS's only made 166CHP, and that was an optimistic power rating from SOA.

[StatGSR]

^ this, i know an ej25 can make it its been done, but the parts list doesn't equal 1500, let alone paying somebody to put it together. expect 700 for pistons alone, plus 300 for reground cams, then add a good port and polish? hell a professional one of those can cost you 1000 on easy.....

thats why i say BS, if your builders have some magical way to put down that kinda power on the cheap, it needs to be shared with the subaru world, cause nobody else has done it.

also talking about a tleg with a na 2.5 vs new turbo outback... the weight difference alone is a huge advantage for the tleg.

[RS MN]

^ this, i know an ej25 can make it its been done, but the parts list doesn't equal 1500, let alone paying somebody to put it together. expect 700 for pistons alone, plus 300 for reground cams, then add a good port and polish? hell a professional one of those can cost you 1000 on easy.....

thats why i say BS, if your builders have some magical way to put down that kinda power on the cheap, it needs to be shared with the subaru world, cause nobody else has done it.

also talking about a tleg with a na 2.5 vs new turbo outback... the weight difference alone is a huge advantage for the tleg.


*high five*

[lord flashheart]

Well, the headers, injectors, intake, etc is not included. Again I didn't build it. So I don't know what went into it. I said this is what I want this is how much I have to spend. He said here you go. Also this didn't occur to me till now, but he may be giving me a deal on this since I spent $7000 last month at the shop. Regardless, what I speak is the truth.

The power curve is the reason I chose the n/a ej over the ej20k swap. I sacrificed 60 whatever HP for n/a. As it is a rally cross project and turbo lag is a real pain on dirt.

And yes I am aware that the legacy was like a quarter of a ton lighter. Which is why his car kept up. Seeing how my car has much more power. It compensates for the extra weight.

But to be honest I really tired of arguing, so your right I lied there is no 200+ HP n/a motor for $1500. End of discussion. If u want to see how the motor plays out, follow my 1995 build thread. The outback is still having problems so I haven't started the swap yet.

[RS MN]

...what I speak is the truth...


...your right I lied...

:smt017

[Reason]

He is ending it because he doesn't want to go back and forth with the same shit. If he dropped 7k earlier the guy is probably giving him a deal. If that's the case he is getting it for what he said. What's the big deal? Wait for the car do ne done. If be shows dyno numbers then you can get on his ass if they aren't at what was expected.

[RS MN]

He is ending it because he doesn't want to go back and forth with the same shit. If he dropped 7k earlier the guy is probably giving him a deal. If that's the case he is getting it for what he said. What's the big deal? Wait for the car do ne done. If be shows dyno numbers then you can get on his ass if they aren't at what was expected.

i understand that hes done arguing, i just thought his post was contradictory.

and if he doesnt know what he spent on the engine, then i fully expect him to have dyno numbers where he said they would be. i dont mean to get on his ass, and if i offended, i am sorry, its the internet lol. i really do want to see a parts list and dyno sheets. ive always liked the concept of building up these engines for NA power, but it always seemed illogical from a budget standpoint when you compare it to used turbo parts and swaps. an engine ive been thinking about for a long time is an NA high comp EJ207 (JDM STI engine).

[lord flashheart]

I'm not offended, im just tired of the "yes it does" "no it dosent". When everything is hooked up and I find money to dyno it. I don't doubt that this motor will put its money where its mouth is. If it doesn't I'm a big enough guy to admit when I'm wrong. But I'm still confident. If these numbers don't sound right tell me.
The dyno numbers I see there is a 45hp loss in the transmission so
I'm accounting for 45hp loss to mechanical drag. And the Target is 220chp with 10hp margin. Which means I need to hit 175whp minimum For this to be a 'success' in my book.

[RS MN]

I'm not sure at all how much power is lost in all the rotational mass in the drivetrain. But 175 sounds about right, I think it could be a tad lower though. the stock rs engine made 166 chp (again, according to SOA, I think that's a high estimate) but only put down ~90-110AWHP, depending on the dyno, altitude, temp, humidity, etcetc. And does your builder have a dyno in their facility? If so you could probably get them to let you do a few pulls so they could have some numbers to use for advertising or the like.

[lord flashheart]

They don't have one you drive onto. They have one that you bolt to the motor to. But it takes a while and dyno time is like $65ish per hour (friend pricing). But it takes a few hours to set it up, tune it, and test it. And this dumb outback has been putting a HUGE dent in the budget for my rally car. If the outback hadn't blown a motor, the rally car budget would be about $5000 bigger. And dyno time would be no biggie..

[RS MN]

Are you on a local forum for your area at all? If so, try to set up a dyno day with a bunch of other members and a local shop with a dyno that's down with the subaru community. It gets a lot cheaper that way, and its also a great way to bring the local subaru community together.

[lord flashheart]

yeah im planning on it, i just missed the last one, it was like 3 weeks ago.

[StatGSR]

I'm sorry, but the only reason i am being a prick about this is because this thread is about somebody deciding between and ej20t and a ej25 na and looking for technical information, and your swaying that person with an engine that you 1) don't have running in a car yet, 2) don't know the specifics about what has been done to it, and 3) are basing its value on what is likely deflated price because of your prior business with company/ or your actually getting much less than you think you are.

I understand your choice as to go with this motor for your project (you dont want turbo lag for a rally cross car, i get it thats why i went eg33), but your strong bias towards a motor you know very little about is extremely unhelpful in what should be a very technical thread.

now if you said hey, these guys will make a ej25 motor for $1500-2500 or whatever that has XXX cams, XXX CR pistons, and a P&P head. and here is what mine made with injectors, exhaust and intake on a stock ecu <insert dyno plot here> then i would feel your argument would be justifiable, and belongs in a technical thread, but you talked about the motor and how great it is when at the same time you don't know much of anything about it.

That said, i hope you get the results you are looking for and i also hope you will share with us what was actually done to your 2.5 when you get the chance. Again i apologize if i seam rude, but i hate when threads get flooded with speculation and not facts/truths, anybody can promise something, but what matters is what they deliver.



He is ending it because he doesn't want to go back and forth with the same shit. If he dropped 7k earlier the guy is probably giving him a deal. If that's the case he is getting it for what he said. What's the big deal? Wait for the car do ne done. If be shows dyno numbers then you can get on his ass if they aren't at what was expected.

this thread is not supposed to be about Lords motor, this is a thread somebody else started asking a comparative question, that person deserves to not be biased by what could be false information. then again, this is the internet, so one will always have to wade through the shit to get any factual information. i hate to see new people pushed one way by what is presented to them as fact, which in this case it clearly isn't. freshen up on the beginning of this thread to see what i mean.

/Rant...????

[lord flashheart]

But to be honest I really tired of arguing, so your right I lied there is no 200+ HP n/a motor for $1500. End of discussion. If u want to see how the motor plays out, follow my 1995 build thread. The outback is still having problems so I haven't started the swap yet.
^that.

And yeah your being a prick. I told you, ok, don't have a dyno so ill shut up till I have one.

[StatGSR]

As much as i would like to see a dyno of your motor (and I'm sure we all will eventually), i am also just as interested in what was specifically put into it, which was something i hoped you could provide well before you could actually get it on a dyno.

and yea, you don't have to tell me I'm being a pick, i admitted to that in my last post. i guess i deserve an arguing over the internet award....

[lord flashheart]

Sorry. Your right that was uncalled for. My frustrated that I agreed to stop bragging about a motor i don't have proof of its.capability, and yet you continued to go off about it. You have made your point. I don't have that info because I've been busy with other things. I'll get it posted. However it will be in my build thread. As stated, this isn't about my motor, so if you want to hear about it you will need to go there.

[StatGSR]

^ looking forward to it!

[ouch1011]

I would do a turbo build only if I had another car on the road that was reliable and ready to bring my ass to work every day.

I'm buying another car specifically for that reason. The only way I would run a swapped Subaru as a daily driver is if you literally took everything from the donor car (ALL the powertrain parts, electronics, etc) and put it in your car. Even a stock WRX engine will probably break an N/A 5spd over time, which means probably being left stranded and downtime.

For a Legacy, I wouldn't run a EJ20 personally. They have no power w/o boost, and require a LOT of boost to make good power. For a heavy Legacy, that would be far from ideal. I'd planned on going with a JDM STI engine (one with AVCS) but both the cost of importing one and the lack of power out of boost pushed me away. Now I've got an EJ257 sitting in the garage, waiting for a rebuild. The EJ255/257 has plenty of power even below 3k rpm (my friends STI feels faster even down to 1500rpm than my LGT). It should say something that the only turbocharged engines available in the 2nd Legacy were sequential twin turbo (to help compensate for turbo lag/lack of NA power)

[lord flashheart]

Yeah agreed. After driving my obxt for a while I drove a 02wrx and it made hardly any power till 4500, then you had ok power till 6k then you shift and put at the beginning of the boost. They just felt so laggy and slow, however I must make a couple points.
1, the stock wrx will break a stock wrx 5 speed over time. Its all about how hard on the trans you are. That's why subaru made it so you can't dump the clutch as hard on the 02+ wrxs. The 01s you could do it as hard as you wanted.

Point 2: the second gen legacy 5spd (TZ45 or whatever the code is) will hold up to stock ej257 HP. If you set it up right and don't slam gears and POP the clutch. When you dog the gear box, something gotta give and with AWD it will probably not be the tires and if you get a high performance clutch, the only thing left to break is trans or diff. I know multiple people who run a ej257 with a 2.2 5spd with no problems (about 15k miles now). They got a high pressure pressure plate with a soft clutch plate. You get the grip in the clutch you want but if you over do it the clutch gives first. Personally I think That's why the 05+ legacy 2.5gt clutches are known for slipping. Because the clutch giving loose it saves the gears box. I think subaru set it up that way.

[cbroo]

to OP: sorry its late
I put in a "used" cosworth cam in my ej252 after getting the stock heads replaced under warranty, new rings and borla heads, with a custom exhaust.... cam costed $300 with 35k on it which was installed at 110k and the exhaust was put on a month after I bought the car with 45k on it.. Basically I spent $750 total on my cam, heads, intake, labor... and had a friend do the job in 9 days... so I don't want to say look for cheap parts but if you know some good people and take your time you can make out like a bandit looking for upgrades...Piece together what you want done to your car, unless you have alot of $$. I've never dyno my car but once the cams and heads were replaced, I felt a significant difference in first to third gear.. also I'm just now hitting 175k on original motor and running strong as a fairly dailey driver, but I figure once the motor craps the bed I will do a swap for something turbo. But I do like giving my friends with ej20t a run to 50mph or so.

but heres a link for a 00' swap in CO
http://www.sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=4346

[rougeben83]

Lol, I've pretty much broken every "rule of thumb" that you shouldn't do to a swapped subaru.

My simple advice is this: You want a turbo? Go big the first time or forget about it. There's nothing special about dropping a few grand only to end up with a *stock* turbocharged car.

Got a budget that you have to really stick to? Stick with bolt-ons and cams on your car, make roughly 200bhp and be happy with your torque curve and linear power delivery.