and so begins...

[strat81]

my hatred for the 4EAT...

we got our first snow yesterday/today and i went out in my newly acquired wagon to have a bit of fun. found an empty parking lot, opened'er up, and cranked the wheel... and just kept going straight... much to my dismay. after a few more attempts with similar results i remembered reading somewhere that the torque bias is something like 90/10 in Drive but goes 50/50 in 1 (maybe 2 as well... i can't remember) so i dropped her down into 1st and tried again. BAM... i'm sideways and grinning like a crazy man. my complaint is that i hate having to run the car in 1st to have any kind of fun in the snow because it doesn't seem like a good idea to crank it up and then let it slow down repeatedly like that.

now for the newb question... is there anyway to have the car running something closer to 50/50 with the 4EAT while in D without either a. screwing up the tranny/center diff or b. swapping in a manual (although i'd like to... it's just not a feasible option right now)?

[dropdfocus]

I smell a manual swap coming on!!! :twisted:

[redlegacygt]

i've been thinking of a manual swap too. i had to do the same thing yesturday while playing in the snow and i dont like it. I've prob. only got it sideways once while having it in drive or even 3rd. However once your in 1st, its easy to sling it in circles. :D

[EXP1787]

:faroah: Pharaoh says: You car is too nice to be an automatic.

[Wiscon_Mark]

It locks up in "2" also Spencer ;)

That won't be so hard on the rpms. Honestly, a 5MT swap would be the toughest thing any of us would ever do, harder than an engine swap. But here's a writeup on it:

http://www.legacycentral.org/library/tr ... onvert.htm (http://www.legacycentral.org/library/transmission/convert.htm)

That library is filled with all sorts of cool stuff! :D

[EXP1787]

Honestly, a 5MT swap would be the toughest thing any of us would ever do, harder than an engine swap.
But still very doable with time and friends ;)

[Huffer]

D2 is def 50/50. And is easier on the rpms too.

D3 will work in light slush, it does direct torque to the rear quicker than D4.
(what I've found)

[gator gt]

I dunno, Mark. Sure you have to get a rear diff to match the tranny and have the proper driveshaft (plus a hydraulic system for the clutch; all of which will bolt up), but doing a motor swap is a lot more technically involved and gives more of a chance to screw something up.

Besides, a tranny swap (AT-->MT) raises the fun factor of your car considerably!

aside: if anyone of you have a 96 with a 4EAT and want to do MT and keep the ABS, let me know, I've got a 96 ABS controller with g-sensor for the 96 MT car...going up for sale soon.

95 & 96 Legacys had separate control modules from the hydraulic unit.

GGT

[Huffer]

Turns out (according to xcntrk75) that if you want the ABS to continue to function, just leave the 4EAT TCU plugged in (the ABS harness bit).

[Wiscon_Mark]

Turns out (according to xcntrk75) that if you want the ABS to continue to function, just leave the 4EAT TCU plugged in (the ABS harness bit).

That's for a 97+ vehicle, 95-96 might be different.

[TheBigJesus.]

Yay automatic with sportshift! I had some fun in the snow in my 05 2.5i a couple weeks ago :)

[Manarius]

Car will split 50-50 in D4. My car does it all the time. You shouldn't have to drop it in 2 just to get 50-50 split.

[Wiscon_Mark]

Car will split 50-50 in D4. My car does it all the time. You shouldn't have to drop it in 2 just to get 50-50 split.

you have to slip around a bit in D4 for it to go to 50/50 though. Spencer wants insta 50/50 which can only be had in 1 or 2.

[gator gt]

Turns out (according to xcntrk75) that if you want the ABS to continue to function, just leave the 4EAT TCU plugged in (the ABS harness bit).

That's for a 97+ vehicle, 95-96 might be different.

Thats correct Mark, the 95 & 96 Legacys have separate controllers for AT and MT.

GGT

[strat81]

abs doesn't work on my wagon anyways so that isn't a problem... next i thought that the clutch systems on the legacy's were cable not hydraulic?

i don't see how it would be THAT hard if i have a donor car to pull what i need... (some of the problems he listed seem like they could be fixed with the right ecu and tcu which if i had a donor/parts car, wouldn't be a problem)

anyways, 2 will work with 50/50 instantly? the car won't go sideways in D (believe me i tried quite a bit)

[ooberdoob]

5MT FTW


(i really couldn't help the shameless plug, but its ok, cause at least you've gotten to drive your car in the snow)

[Sarra]

abs doesn't work on my wagon anyways so that isn't a problem... next i thought that the clutch systems on the legacy's were cable not hydraulic?

i don't see how it would be THAT hard if i have a donor car to pull what i need... (some of the problems he listed seem like they could be fixed with the right ecu and tcu which if i had a donor/parts car, wouldn't be a problem)

anyways, 2 will work with 50/50 instantly? the car won't go sideways in D (believe me i tried quite a bit)

Legacies previous to 2000 had cable clutches, UNLESS they had a turbo. :) My 2000 Legacy L has a hydrolic, and honestly, it is the touchiest clutch I've ever used. =\ I'd perfer a cable clutch, honestly, but the hydrolic is smoothe.

If you do a manual tranny swap, I'd suggest going bulletproof and getting a 6 speed. If you ever plan on increasing engine output, you'll be glad for it. :) It is a lot more work, especially hooking up DCCD, unless you can get a 6MT from Japan that doesn't have a DCCD.

IIRC, there's a sensor that detects if the rear wheels and front wheels are spinning at different speeds when in D, it's possible that that sensor isn't connected right, and when you try getting sideways, it doesn't detect the speed difference. I know my Mom's outback will stay 90/10 for about 2 seconds when in drive and in a slippery situation.

Next time you go for some fun in the snow, try Reverse and put the FWD fuse in. ;)

Speaking of the FWD fuse, does it lock the tranny into 90/10, or into a true 100/0 situation? No matter how hard I tried, I coudln't get my mom's outback to do FWD bunouts with the fuse in (granted, I didn't try very hard).

[Wiscon_Mark]

Legacies previous to 2000 had cable clutches, UNLESS they had a turbo. :) My 2000 Legacy L has a hydrolic, and honestly, it is the touchiest clutch I've ever used. =\ I'd perfer a cable clutch, honestly, but the hydrolic is smoothe.

Wrong. 96 was the last year of the cable clutch in the Legacies. That's why all those 97+ Legacies can get the good short shifters :evil:


If you do a manual tranny swap, I'd suggest going bulletproof and getting a 6 speed. If you ever plan on increasing engine output, you'll be glad for it. :) It is a lot more work, especially hooking up DCCD, unless you can get a 6MT from Japan that doesn't have a DCCD.

I'll disagree with this one too. A 6 speed is way expensive, you could get a 5 speed built to handle tons of power for less than the cost of a 6 speed. DCCD is just more weight on a car that doesn't have a powerful engine, you guys have to remember, this is just a DD/winter beater car for Spencer.


IIRC, there's a sensor that detects if the rear wheels and front wheels are spinning at different speeds when in D, it's possible that that sensor isn't connected right, and when you try getting sideways, it doesn't detect the speed difference. I know my Mom's outback will stay 90/10 for about 2 seconds when in drive and in a slippery situation.

I'd just say that the sensor is doing its job and isn't allowing spencer to slip around a lot. Or its lagging for a couple seconds, before it compensates.


Speaking of the FWD fuse, does it lock the tranny into 90/10, or into a true 100/0 situation? No matter how hard I tried, I coudln't get my mom's outback to do FWD bunouts with the fuse in (granted, I didn't try very hard).

It locks it in 100/0, but with some power loss, doing burnouts is a TERRIBLE idea. Besides, I didn't think you could do burnouts in an auto (or it was really hard).

[strat81]

no fwd/reverse donuts for me... i already had a fwd in the winter and that's not my idea of fun :P

as mark said, this is my DD and i'm not planning on dropping in a bigger, more expensive engine and transmission combo. i already have one car that loves my money... i can't afford 2 :lol: i COULD probably pick up a legacy tranny/flywheel/ecu/tcu/driveshaft/crossmember/pedal assembly/rear diff (if i'd need it)/etc for a "fairly cheap" price with the one junkyard we have near by. i'm thinking probably under 300 for everything (excluding the clutch) and i know i have a few savvy mechanic friends in the area...

an MT swap may happen sometime down the road but for the moment, i'll deal with the 4eat... at least i know what gears i should be able to have some fun in now 8)

[Legacy-Version94]

sell it and get a 5-speed Legacy!

[strat81]

probably wouldn't get enough out of it to buy another legacy... not just that, FINDING a 5spd legacy in the area isn't easily done.

[ivwarrior]

Finding a used 5 speed in this area is tough, in any vehicle. I've had several used car dealers tell me they won't get a manual trans vehicle, unless it's a "special order" for someone. They say "nobody wants them".

[Sarra]

Odd, I thought the 99 had the cable clutch. =\ Oh, wait, sorry, I'm thinking the Impreza? They still had the 2.2 in 1999, it had the cable clutch (or am I thinking of another breed of car all together?)


I'll disagree with this one too. A 6 speed is way expensive, you could get a 5 speed built to handle tons of power for less than the cost of a 6 speed. DCCD is just more weight on a car that doesn't have a powerful engine, you guys have to remember, this is just a DD/winter beater car for Spencer.

Well, for just a winter beater that's going to stay with the stock motor, then yeah, a 6MT would be a waste. But no, I will disagree with you on the 5MT. In order to convert my 5MT to be able to take 600 hp, it would require about $10k, which would be about $2-4k less than getting a 6MT professionally installed in my car at the Tuning place in Portland, IIRC.

[Huffer]

WTH would strat want 600hp in his daily driver/winter car???
:lol: