02_Legacys Supercharger build 6/16 oops :-(

[02_Legacy]

So thanks to l0rd I got a wonderful package in the mail today:

Mercedes M62
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/02/IMG_0800-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/02/IMG_0799-1.jpg

Emanage Ultimate
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/02/IMG_0803-1.jpg

and a Inovate Wideband and gauge
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/02/IMG_0806-1.jpg

So I'm currently in the parts collection phase. This should be a fairly quickly paced build. First steps are get the emanage and wideband wired in and practice with some tuning as I have never done it before. During this I will be collecting parts for the main install and doing lots of research.

And here is my first question: TMIC, FMIC, or AWIC?
Right now I am leaning very heavly to AWIC. Why?
First of all I don't have a hood scoop, otherwise I would be all over a TMIC. A new hood + paint would cost more than either a TMIC or AWIC.
FMIC can be done cheap but is a lot of work. My bumper is not made for a front mount, and I really don't want to chop it and the reinforcement up. Not to mention a FMIC decreases throttle response and creates a small lag.
AWIC is slightly more expensive, however, easy to mount, less piping, and I can get a larger slim mount radiator and it would require no bumper choping at all.
Thoes are my thoughts so far, anyone else have an opinion?

[LGT Kirby]

Cut a whole in your hood and put in a scoop and call it good! Haha

[httrdd]

Yea not sure what a awic is, but most supercharger builds start upwithout exterior cooling. Save up some money and do the tmic and hood scoop. More sleepy looking.

[StatGSR]

^ AWIC = Air Water Intercooler

AWIC would probably work the best in your case, but have you considered a small side mount IC, like those used by DSMs? might be able to fit one of those with less issues.

[02_Legacy]

Well I would like to put a hood scoop on my hood, but my hood needs to be replaced. I hit a tree and as a result I have a small crease in my hood, it is only noticeable if you are really looking for it but I'm not going to spend alot of time doing a custom job to a bad hood, and its not bad enough to justify getting a new hood just because of that. I am waiting to hit a deer because I have insurance on the car and we have komakaze deer up here, so its going to happen some time. (though it is another thing to consider with FMIC or AWIC) So i'm am just factoring the price of a new hood (turbo baja) into the TMIC price.

I have considered going directly to the TB with no intercooler, however, I read somewhere, skidds build I think, that as far as efficiency and heat production go this supercharger is not much better than a turbo.

I'm still doing research on this though to try and figure it out.

In other news, I ordered a few 20 pin connectors (to hook up the emanage so it can be removed) and a ELM327 bluetooth module and a VAG-COM cable (to monitor engine with ECU tracker)

Adjustable FPR, boost gauge, and GM 2-bar map sensor are soon to follow.

[anothernord]

Yep, the pressure ratio you'll run this blower at will produce some very hot air.

I would get a scoop and use a TMIC. Why? Hood scoops are cool, TMIC's are cheap and easy to find, as well as easy to mount.

Sounds like you're off to a great start!

[mlitz]

This looks awesome! cant wait for more updates... and an AWIC would prob be an easier way to go but a top mount or even a side mount is not a bad idea.

[SilverSuby]

What'd you pay for this??

[02_Legacy]

It was $580 for the supercharger (supposedly just rebuilt), the emanage, the inovate wideband and gauge, and a WRX fuel pump.

I am keeping a detailed build cost chart and will make sure to post it up when I'm closer to the end of the build.

I did some research and took some measurements and it looks like this is a good canidate:
http://www.frozenboost.com/product_info.php?cPath=218&products_id=213&osCsid=7c107c326e6cd7cfd66a7785d7be9490
It should be able to fit right where a TMIC would go. I am going to e-mail them and see if I can get some more detailed measurements just to make sure though, cause it is pretty close.

[mlitz]

Yeh that looks good... You are going to run a closed water cooling system right?

[02_Legacy]

Whats the alternative to a closed loop system? I haven't heard of anything else. But yes I'm planning on getting a heat exchanger, with a large surface area but thin, and a bilge pump. Still doing more research before I pick those out though. I will have to run coolant in the system though, I know it will decrease efficiency some but i'm not too worried about it.

[mlitz]

using your system that is in your car now with the factory water pump... it is not very common as there is a lot of extra heat.

[02_Legacy]

Started getting the wiring for the emanage sorted out today. I don't have any shrink wrap so I couldn't start soldering yet. But I have all the connections laid out and I figured out which pins from the ECU match up with the emanage inputs/outputs.
Anyways I found a small problem, some of the wires are missing. Mainly connector C pins 1,2,7, and 8. Not a huge deal as they are for the analog in/out, water temp, and intake air temp, but still annoying. What is also really annoying is the connectors are designed so that you cant move pins. I was just going to take a wires that I am not using and put them in the missing spots but the pins do not come out without damaging the connector. Ugh!

Also adjustable FPR, extra TB, and GM MAP sensor are supposed to be here Wed.

Edit: Ok so its isn't impossible to move the pins. I guess I just needed a little time to get a new perspective. So everything is all laid out for me now, I just have to make the connections. I'm hoping to get the emanage installed this weekend.

[02_Legacy]

Today I wired up the Emanage harness. What a pain! I double and triple checked everything so I should be good there. Hopefully tomorrow afternoon I will get a good start on wiring the ECU part of it. Sprink Break is next week, but i'm so busy that I will have less time then when i'm in school so after the emanage is in it will be a short break before I get time to work on it again.

Here is some pics of the rats nest that the emanage harness turned into:
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/03/IMG_0808-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/03/IMG_0809-1.jpg

[redlegacygt]

Awesome work man. Ive been looking at using the emange for my hybrid build. Ill def. Be watching to see how you like it

[anothernord]

Excellent. The ability to unplug the EMU and troubleshoot with just the stock ECU is priceless. Consider leaving extra pins open for future wires to be added such as knock, water temp, sub injectors, etc.

[02_Legacy]

Ya I have 4 unused pins in the connectors and only 3 wires coming from the EMU that are not hooked up (intake temp, VTEC output, and RPM signal) so I should be good there.
I have been playing around with the software for a little bit now. I put together a map that I am happy with for now from bits and pieces of a few maps that I found in other build threads. I won't be able to fine tune it until get it hooked up of course. It is actually fairly easy to use, I don't think that tuning will be a difficult as I once anticipated.

Redlegacy, I don't know what you are doing for your hybrid but personally I would think the the Emanage would be a waste unless you are going FI. The stock ECU can read and compensate for most changes under normal (vacuum) conditions. You won't be able to change the A/F ratio because it will run in closed loop most of the time. On my maps I have no correction for everything in vacuum. As soon as I hit boost I am going to simulate WOT which will make the computer go open loop and then i will be able to tune as I want.

[anothernord]

Cool. I have quite a bit of experience with the EMU, so feel free to ask questions.

[redlegacygt]

The plan is a turbo hybrid build. ej22 bottom end with ej25 heads etc etc... I've seen a few peoples builds who have used the emange for their turbo builds and they didn't really have any complaints. I would like to go with a links G4 storm, but who knows..

[02_Legacy]

well this weekend didn't turn out as I had hoped :(
I only had a few hours today to work on the wires and only ended up getting 6 wires soldered. As was suggested I was doing just a few wires at a time then starting the car to make sure everything was alright. First I attached power and ground and loaded a map that was all zeros. I used one of skidds maps as a starting point so I didn't have to figure out all the vehicle specifics. Then I attached the ign. wires and TPS wire. I started it and cranking time was long and once I started it idled it but would studder bad as soon as I hit the gas. I hooked up the computer and it said that there was no airflow input. So I connected the MAP sensor and there was no change. By that time it was getting dark and cold so I quit to give me time to think about it.
Only thing I have come up with so far is that for some reason the map settings are off. Maybe I will start with another map and change it to all zeros and try that.

[anothernord]

You need the airflow input and output wired in at the same time. That should do the trick.

[02_Legacy]

The map sensor is my airflow in/out, I don't have a MAF sensor. Even after I hooked that up it didn't make a difference. Some more thinking has me wondering about the TPS. That was hooked up at the same time so maybe the emanage is throwing off the signal to the ECM. It is just a tap wire though so the EMU doesn't alter the signal at all. I hooked up ECUtracker and it showed the TPS sensor was reading. I never compared the reading with what the pedal was doing though. It does seem that before at rest ECUtracker showed 0.0 for TPS. After hooking up the EMU it cycled between 0.0 and 0.2 so just say that the ECM sees .1 I'll have to do some more checking but sadly I have little time.

[02_Legacy]

I got 10 mins to look at it today, here is what I found:

The problem lies in the ignition. If I bypass the EMU with the ignition but leave the others hooked up everything works fine.
The problem is not the map, I loaded 3 zeroed out maps and they all acted the same
The EMU is reading RPM fine off the ign signal
The data log shows ign timing all over the place, it cycles from +150 to -150 and everywhere in between.
Changing the ign map seems to make no noticeable difference, I put -5 in every cell and didn't notice any difference.

Once again what is happening is that any load in the engine causes it to bog really bad. At about 5% throttle from idle it will be normal, any more than that and it bogs right down. Any more than 50% throttle from idle and it will kill the engine. Only wires I have hooked up right now are power, ground, MAP, TPS, and both ign wires.

So is my EMU not working right? Am I doing something wrong? Should I keep hooking up wires and maybe the EMU will get an input it needs to get the right output?
My thing is with the maps zeroed whatever the input is the output should be, so why is the EMU changing the output?
Help me!!

[anothernord]

Sounds like your crank sensor type. Try different ones in the parameters section. Also, you want your RPM signal to be referenced from the ignition signal. I'm away from my computer, otherwise I'd tell you which one, nut it think it's something like "SB-3".

[02_Legacy]

I don't have my crank or cam sensor hooked up yet. Maybe that is my problem? And the EMU is reading RPM just fine from the ignition signal now. I just don't get why the EMU would change the signal at all when the maps are all zeros regardless if is sees a crank signal or not.

[02_Legacy]

I think my emanage might be toast :( I tripple checked all the wiring and jumpers. I shorted the ign. wires at the emanage and it ran fine then so all wiring is good. I don't really know of anything else to check. I may hook up the crank/cam signals just to see what the EMU is data logging. (I read that the cam/crank signals are not necessary for the EMU to operate but are needed to log timing)
I read a few places that people came up with bad ones but I didn't think I would get one. This is probable a month set back, not to mention the money for another one. :smt009

[anothernord]

Ok, just to check your settings:

You should have 2 ignition wires hooked up for a wasted spark 4-cylinder.
In the Emanage's "IGN" tab, you should have "2" for input and output channels. then in the chart below, there should be a 1 and 2 for CH 1 and 2 respectively.

Also, did you check your jumpers on the inside? If it doesn't have the jumper setting for a wasted spark ignition, then it won't work too. Don't give up yet.

[02_Legacy]

Anothernord, THANK YOU!
Lol what you said about the jumpers being set for a waste spark system made me look over the jumper discriptions again. Though I still don't see one that sets it specifically for waste spark I did see one that set output voltage and I had it set at 5v (per skidds build thread) I though that was wierd so i swiched it and tried again and it works :grin:
What was happening is by only supplying a 5v signal the firing voltage was super low so as cylinder pressures raised under load there simply was not enough voltage to create a spark.
:grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
I'm happy now.

[anothernord]

I knew you'd figure it out. I remember having to keep taking my Emanage apart all the time because I couldn't get the jumpers right ever. Glad you got it working!

[02_Legacy]

Well everything is wired up with the e-manage now and its all working perfectly. Now I need to take an afternoon to install my fuel pump, FPR, and do the parallel fuel rail mod. I need to get to an exhaust shop to get the wide band bung welded in too. I was looking and its going to be a tight fit to get the sensor in the exhaust, there is really no great place to put it.

[02_Legacy]

Finally an update!

Today I had some time so I put my adjustable FPR in and did the parallel fuel rail mod. It didn't go perfect, the Y-block that I had cracked when I was installing the fittings so I had to go and get a T just to get my car back on the road. I was going to put in my WRX fuel pump too but there is a warning not to remove the fuel pump unless there is less than 3/4 of a tank and I had just filled up :-(
Here are some pics, bonus points if you can actually tell what I did lol

https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/03/IMG_7233-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/03/IMG_7234-1.jpg

I'm hoping to get my wideband put in sometime this week and get my PS reservoir moved. As it turns out this project is taking more time then I origionally thought :neutral:

[02_Legacy]

Today I spent a few hours figuring out what injector sizes to use with the EMU to get minimal fuel trims with higher fuel pressures. I have it set to about 60PSI static pressure right now and fuel trims are +/-5.
One thing though is that the FPR does not hold pressure after the key is turned off. It hits 0 within 10 mins. Its kinda annoying because now my crank time is longer. Anyone know if this is just a characteristic of aftermarket FPR?

[mlitz]

Today I spent a few hours figuring out what injector sizes to use with the EMU to get minimal fuel trims with higher fuel pressures. I have it set to about 60PSI static pressure right now and fuel trims are +/-5.
One thing though is that the FPR does not hold pressure after the key is turned off. It hits 0 within 10 mins. Its kinda annoying because now my crank time is longer. Anyone know if this is just a characteristic of aftermarket FPR?

No your FPR should not do that... it is either your FPR or your injectors.

and are you talking about +/-5 on the short term or long term fuel trims? and is that at open loop or closed?

[02_Legacy]

from what I have figured it is normal for an aftermarket adjustable FPR to bleed off. I am guessing it is because they work on a different principal than stock (which aren't supposed to loose any pressure after key is off) so that fuel pressure can be adjusted. Even more expensive regulators do this. I am learning to wait a few secs between key on and crank so that I get some fuel pressure and don't wear out the starter.

Fuel trims are +/-5 in both short and long term. And fuel trims don't change in open loop so that is irrelevant for right now.

[02_Legacy]

Its been a busy day but I got alot done on the project. PS resivoir is relocated to the passenger side firewall. WRX fuel pump is in. Innovate LC-1 is in position and all wires are ran to where they need to go they just need to be soldered. The GM map sensor is in place and wires are run for that but also not hooked up.
DIN gauge pod, boost gauge, colder spark plugs, a replacement fuel Y-block, and connectors for the EMU option ports are all ordered too.
I also tore the whole interior apart and hid all the wires. I decided to put my EMU under the passenger side seat.
Sorry no pics today but I will have some hopefully tomorrow.

[anothernord]

You don't have to buy plugs foe the EMU, just trim one of those little PC cd drive audio cables. Fit perfect.

[02_Legacy]

ya that is what I bought, its just easier to say I bought EMU option connectors then CD-ROM audio connectors that I can trim to make into option plugs lol.

[02_Legacy]

Still no pics but I went on a spending spree lately so my parts list is almost complete, just have to wait for everything to get here. My recent perchases:
air water intercooler - $130
heat exchanger - $150
bilage pump for AWIC setup - $41
various silicone couplers and T-clamps - $52 (these things are expensive :shock: )
Supercharger oil - $25

So far total build cost is $1,139 including everything. Not too bad considering I am pretty much finished collecting parts.

[02_Legacy]

Well I did a little bit this weekend. The biggest thing that I did is get the gauge pod installed and my A/F ratio gauge and boost gauge in place. The gauges them selves are all hooked up but the wideband needs to be installed yet and the boost gauge sending unit needs to be wired in. The third opening is going to get a cover and there will be a couple warning lights there instead of a gauge. One will be a turboXS knocklite, one will be a 15psi oil warning light, and hopefully I can get a light hooked up to the EMU's warning feature.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7249-1.jpg
The surround is not installed in this pic because I painted it and it is still drying.

Also did a test fit of the AWIC, it should fit fine, I need to trim the silicone couplers for a better fit but it will make it. Also notice the PS resivoir relocate.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7243-1.jpg

Here is a quick pic I snapped of where I put the map sensor.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7245-1.jpg

And lastly here is a pic of the heat exchanger that I got. I changed my mind at the last second, I was going to go with a 24x12x1 but I ended up with this 12x12x2. It is not going to fit as well as I had hoped but I will make it go. It takes up about half of the radiator area but I'm hopeing that I can move it far enough over that I don't have to mess with the hood latch.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7255-1.jpg

Now one question for anyone familiar with the EMU. I want to know how that warning system works. The user manual says that the warning uses the activation LED light. Where my EMU is I cannot see the activation light but would still like to know if I am approaching a high injector duty cycle. So my question is what exactly does the activation LED do when the warning activates. I would like to hook a LED of my own up to it but I don't want it on all the time like the activation LED is.

[r3v_v3ng3]

Yours is coming along real nice. I have yet to install my gauges and the emanage so I'm behind on the electronics

[02_Legacy]

today I moved the ABS unit, I know it wasn't 100% necessary but I found and easy way to get a few extra inches of clearance so I took it.
Here it is where it sat origionally
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7261-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7262-1.jpg

notice I unplugged the wiring before doing any cutting, don't want to end up hitting the wire. I didn't want to cut up the fender wall at all so I cut the bracket the holds it to the fender and mooved the unit over. Here is a pic after I cut the bracket and removed what I cut.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7263-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7264-1.jpg

And here it is moved over, for now I am just using the stock holes and bolts to hold it down, when I take the front bumper off to do some other stuff I'll drill new holes and properly bolt it down. Also notice the I bent 2 of the lines in a little to make even more room, I should have plenty of room.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7265-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7266-1.jpg

I sent out the pulley this week too, its going to the same person who did skidd's pulley but he lives in New Mexico so its going to be a while before I get it back.
I'm hoping to have all the wiring buttoned up this weekend so all that is left then is the physical mounting of everything.

[02_Legacy]

This was my project today
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7267-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7268-1.jpg

Is that a fire hazard? lol It cleans up nice though.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/04/IMG_7274-1.jpg

All the wiring is pretty much completed now. All that is left is some connections by the ECU, namely the knock sensor, RPM signal and analog in/out of the EMU.
I'm fabricating a cover for the last gauge hole which will house the knocklite, oil pressure light, and a light connected to the EMU's warning system which I figured out how to wire up.

[anothernord]

The EMU will let you set a bunch of different conditions under which the red warning LED on the front will turn on. If you go to the "Front Panel" tab, and click on the tiny box button, you can select what sensor you want to be monitored. For oil pressure, you'll have to hook up the pressure sender to one of the option ports on the EMU, then enable "factory oil pressure" in the option menu. I don't know what the wiring would look like though.

[02_Legacy]

Ya I got it all figured out now. I tapped the red led light with a wire which I ran to the gauge pod area, I just have to find a light that is bright enough to get noticed and still run off the voltage (3v or 6v haven't checked yet) that the EMU puts out.
And for the oil light I bought an oil sending unit that trips at 15psi which will be wired to a light.

[chrish8r]

In our local Subaru group, we have a guy with WRX that has an AWIC and has it painted white with "Mr. Fusion" on it. But the coolest part is that he took off the scoop and put a piece of plexi glass there so you can see it........You dont hear of many supercharged subarus so im quite interested!!

[02_Legacy]

nice I painted my AWIC black with lime green "subaru" across it, but I won't be cutting up my hood to place a clear piece in there. lol
As long is this was bumped up I will give a progress report. All brackets are made to hold the supercharger in. The intake side is almost all fabbed up, it was a PITA to make work. The pressure side should be pretty easy. I am hoping to have all the plumbing done next weekend, then I just have to mount the heat exchanger and run the plumbing for the AWIC setup. My pulley is on its way here. Getting close!

Here is a teaser pic for you guys:
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/05/IMG_7284-1.jpg

[mlitz]

This is going to be so sick! I can't wait.

[anothernord]

It's pretty tricky to get those intake and pressure side piping flanges together, good luck!

[l0rd]

hey man just checkin on your build, things seem to be going pretty well for ya. I hope this turns out well for you.

[Bostonboy65]

If this works out nicely you ought to make me a kit (:

[02_Legacy]

If this works out nicely you ought to make me a kit (:

Haha I will have a build cost total with most of the parts that you will need, however there is alot of custom fabbing in brackets and intake tract routing, ect. Also, many, many trips to the hardware store that I am not keeping track of.

Here are a few updates for you:
Throttle body trimmed down to fit where it needs too:
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/05/IMG_7295-1.jpg

IAC valve with all fittings to relocate it:
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/05/IMG_7300-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/05/IMG_7298-1.jpg

and my favorite update the custom pulley! This thing looks sweet. The same guy who made skidds pulley made this one also and quality is top notch.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/05/IMG_7303-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/05/IMG_7304-1.jpg

I'll try to get specific pics of the brackets and intake setup one of these days but they are staying at my shop right now because i'm still working on them.

[r3v_v3ng3]

How much did that pulley run you?

[Garrison]

And what psi, and are you still going to run the SC clutched?

[02_Legacy]

How much did that pulley run you?
I sent out a cheap lightweight underdriven crank pulley that I got for $20 and the guy who did the work charged me $180.


And what psi, and are you still going to run the SC clutched?

Haha what psi? good question, I don't know. with this sameish setup skidd is getting 6 (I think), however I read that there is less pressure drop over an AWIC then over a regular TMIC. I'm hoping that I will not go over 8psi and 6 is more ideal for a daily driver, and yes I am still planning on using the SC clutch.

[02_Legacy]

So finally an update! Summer has been busy and even when I have been working on it I haven't been keeping you guys totally updated, sorry.

The big news this weekend is I now have an intercooled N/A engine. I'll let the pics do the talking.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0947-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0949-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0948-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0945-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0950-1.jpg

And here are a few pics of the supercharger all bolted in with both the in and out flanges where they go.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0952-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0951-1.jpg

Here is when everything is all said and done
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0957-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0956-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/07/IMG_0955-1.jpg

Next project is to get the IAC valve plumbed in and move the TB flange so the the TB actually fits without hitting the hood lol.

[02_Legacy]

I had an afternoon to work on this project this past weekend so I acomplished a little bit. The TB is now mounted to the intake of the SC and it actually clears everything :roll: and I also moved the idler pulley over a little so the belt returning from the SC to the crank pulley has plenty of clearance.

Next project is to plumb in the IAC valve

[chuckthefuk]

subscribed

[MonstarMotorsports]

^ x2

[Garrison]

I hate to say this, but your cooler is going to need more air than that. Think about cutting vents/slits into your bumper in order to increase airflow.

Looking great so far though!

[chuckthefuk]

*cough* 03-04 BE/BH bumper *cough*

[02_Legacy]

hmm I do like the idea of an 03-04 bumper cover, the vehicle will be getting resprayed sometime in the future so maybe it will happen then, as for currently, if anything I may enlarge the middle hole so that it is a high as the one on the side. However I am not messing with my bumper reinforcement beam or anything in that area. I actually don't think that it is too bad, everything except the section where the bumper beam is should be getting a good flow of air through it. I will keep an eye on my intake temps and decide what needs to happen from there. I am also thinking of wiring the fan that is right behind it to a switch so that in town/ stop and go traffic I can keep the fan on which will draw air through it.

I will have an update after this weekend. It is the first time in a while that I have a freeish weekend so that I can work on it. The IAC valve should be done this weekend, I am planning on getting the pipe from the S/C to the I/C (lol) made on Monday. Then I just have to fab up something to hold the throttle and cruse cables and then everything will be coming apart for powder coating.

[02_Legacy]

man I suck at updating this thread. Last weekend I did end up getting the IACV plumbed in and I also made the bracket to hold the throttle and cruse cables. I got the pipe made on friday at a local shop ($77 :shock: ) Sorry no pics of any of this because it all went over to a friends to get sandblasted and powder coated.

Just did some small stuff today. finally permanently wired up the water pump for my AWIC, ran the wire for the S/C clutch, and painted some small stuff.

Now I have to wait for my parts to come back (he said it may be a couple weeks) In the meantime I am going to start making up a map for the emanage so that I can get this thing fired up as soon as I get it back :cool:

[lord flashheart]

I'm super interested in this. I would love to see some dyno numbers.

[02_Legacy]

Ya I'm definitely planning on getting it on a dyno when I get it running good. There is a place with an AWD dyno jet an hour away from here that will do 3 pulls for $110.
Anyway I started attempting to make my map for the EMU and the resolution of the 3-bar MAP sensor was not good enough. So I somehow managed to find someone parting out a Grand Prix GTP 5 mins away. :grin: so tomorrow I will be picking up a 2-bar MAP sensor and pigtail for $20. Hopefully I will have better luck with it.

[lord flashheart]

I really like the idea of a supercharger build, just for the sake of being different. I really want to supercharge my wires car lol.. and my 4runner. That's not a bad price for 3 pulls. Why was the 3 bar not clear enough? Was it just a cheapo one or what? Anyways I really like your set up. The more I see the 3rd hens the more I like em

[02_Legacy]

I got the 2 bar instead of the 3 bar simply because the 2 bar is more practical. The 3 bar divides 5v into 42PSI (14psi of vacuum and 28 psi of boost) a 2 bar divides 5v into 14psi of vacuum and 14 psi of boost. So it is simply easier to tune when each psi is represented by .2 volts instead of .1 plus I wouldn't be using much of the 3-bar range since I am shooting for 6 psi.

Do you ever do any tuning lord? I am starting to make a map for the EMU and am wondering what A/F ratios I should be targeting. Here is what I have right now. And anyone who knows anything about this can give me any information I am a total noob when it comes to tuning.
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2012/09/EMUmappng-1.jpg
The middle map is target A/F ratio based on rpm (top) and MAP voltage (Left side). 2.30v represents 0psi relative and then every row after that increases by 1psi. Let me know what you think.

[lord flashheart]

um yes and no, ive done a bit of tuning, but im not even slightly familer with the greddy systems.

if i had to guess, i would say thats a pretty rich map. from what i understand you want it to be right around 12 thru the majority of the map, but get a smidge richer in the peak torque area of the engine because thats where your peak VE will be. but this depends on the ignition map as well. i usually set target for 12 then add a little timing, check it, add some timing, check it. etc. then when your start to ping, i back it down a few degrees.
i always learned "leaner is meaner" you want it to be as lean as possible with out hurting the engine, which is about 12-12.5:1 then use timing to bring in the power.
but i am a noob as well and have only worked with stand alones.

[02_Legacy]

So shame on me for not updating this more, but... I'v got boost!!! Not without issues though, when I moved the TB to before the supercharger I found that I have vacuum leaks all over the place. So much so that I am not using any iac right now (the passage is blocked off). I was idling at 2k rpm at first, I have chased down some of them and it is now down to 1k rpm idle with no IAC. second, I do not think my EMU is effecting a/f ratios at all during boost, and I do not know why this is but until I get it corrected I am pretty leery about getting on it too much. So its a work in progress but school and work are slowing me down quite a bit. I will try to get some final pics of everything mounted and in place one of these days.

[chuckthefuk]

Thanks for the update.

[mlitz]

um yes and no, ive done a bit of tuning, but im not even slightly familer with the greddy systems.

if i had to guess, i would say thats a pretty rich map. from what i understand you want it to be right around 12 thru the majority of the map, but get a smidge richer in the peak torque area of the engine because thats where your peak VE will be. but this depends on the ignition map as well. i usually set target for 12 then add a little timing, check it, add some timing, check it. etc. then when your start to ping, i back it down a few degrees.
i always learned "leaner is meaner" you want it to be as lean as possible with out hurting the engine, which is about 12-12.5:1 then use timing to bring in the power.
but i am a noob as well and have only worked with stand alones.

12 is a good number for power... I personally would shoot for 11-11.5:1 and see if you can run a little more timing; or see if you can run 12 with less timing just depends on hp numbers and when and where you see knock. Might try to run VD (http://www.bradbarnhill.com/projects/VirtualDyno/) in the background while you are doing your pulls to get some sort of hp number to work with and see what is making more power. Just remember to go slow and make tiny adjustments, don't get excited or to comfortable and make a mistake.
Also are you running a knock light? might not be a bad investment or at least get someone to help you tune to just watch the computer even if they know nothing about cars tell them that if this colored line (point at the knock signal on the graph) moves at all while I am doing a pull tell me to stop!
Also there is no need to do 4th gear pulls on the street (to dangerous), a full 3ed to 4th then let off will give you a very good street tune until you can afford a dyno tune if you decide to go that route.

[lord flashheart]

Yeah on higher boost engines we stick around 11.5 but with lower boost engines and n/a applications ill do 12.


so wtf guy. We need pictures and videos.

[02_Legacy]

Oops, I took pics of the finished product a while ago but I guess I forgot to post them here :oops: (don't hate on my welds, they do the job lol)
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2013/03/IMG_1084-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2013/03/IMG_1089-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2013/03/IMG_1088-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2013/03/IMG_1087-1.jpg
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2013/03/IMG_1085-1.jpg

As far as progress, I haven't done much recently, between classes and work I have little time to work on my car. I fixed the vacuum leak issues and now have a normal idle with the IAC hooked up. It is still not really tuned, I am having issues with my plan to force the vehicle into open loop and I think it may have to do with the diode that I installed. I need to pull the passenger foot well apart to get to the ECU so I can take a look but have been putting it off.
It works OK for the time being but it has issues with the transition from vacuum to boost. If I just mash the pedal the ECU freaks out and cuts all fuel. If I baby it a little and slowly transition from vacuum to boost the fuel catches up with the extra air and then it takes off. So there are issues that need to be worked out but this issue is my schedule, I just don't have the time right now.

[02_Legacy]

Well I haven't updated this much, truthfully that is because I haven't done much. Everything had been going well until today. I was out beating on my car and all of a sudden it was misfiring. I limped it home, which wasn't far, and pulled the codes. There was a cylinder 4 misfire. The coolant overflow bottle was filled to the top and air bubbles were being pushed out the tube from the radiator. I took the rad cap off and started the engine and gases were visibly coming out of the radiator :-(
So I am going to do the headgaskets but I was wondering what you guys thought about using thicker than normal headgaskets from cometic. I know this would lower compression, but I dont know if thicker gaskets would it be less prone to failure or more likely to fail. Any input on this? Also anyone know the thickness of stock headgaskets?
Thanks for any help.

[02_Legacy]

been doing some more thinking and research and only have more questions now lol, any help is appreciated.
1) I noticed that on cometics site they have MLX style headgaskets that are supposed to seal around the cylinder better, but no thickness is listed for these. Any opinions on them?
2)Anyone ever try changing headgaskets in the vehicle? I am temped to only change the left side without pulling the engine sense that would save a lot of time. Is this a bad idea? If I only did one side I would probably do it without pulling the engine but I would pull the engine to do both sides. I did just do the headgaskets about 20K miles ago because they were externally leaking.

Thanks for any input.

[unsullied_spy]

Doing the head gaskets in the car is doable but very difficult. It is best to remove the engine. Fortunately the engine is easy to take out.

[Garrison]

Doing the head gaskets in the car is doable but very difficult. It is best to remove the engine.

Fortunately the engine is easy to take out.


+1

[lord flashheart]

the head gaskets are lpretty thin. if i were you i would put the stock STi gasket on there they are a bit thicker. dont go too thick on the HG cuz the manifold wont line up if you do.