STI 6MT tranny swap in a BD Legacy wagon

[ProdriveDreams]

So i currently drive a '95 legacy wagon W/an EJ22 engine and a 5MT tranny, but unfortunately the third shift fork with Rev. and 5th on it is breaking and the 5th gear syncro is about to go too, so soon i might be without a 5th gear, and reverse is tricky to shift out of (read: no one but me, the owner can do it). So i've been planning on turning this thing into a road trippin mobile for a while now, and it seems like nows as good a time as any to start.

I plan to go with a STI 6MT transmission, and i am undecided on a powerplant transplant just yet, but im thinking most likely a EJ22T but possibly the EJ207?? (old 2.0 WRX motor). I also plan on adding a nice carputer, and an air ride suspension all around. Additionally i plan to add various internal lights, and a 2-Way security system. I realize that doing the suspension will involve a lot of work as there are currently no air ride kits available for subaru, but i know a few people and will shortly be (cross my fingers) a Service Tech. at a subaru dealership, so being under a hood is a pretty familiar thing for me (start applying next week).

Anyways, back on topic. So my tranny is going and i checked with the dealership, a new 5th gear syncro is in the hundreds of dollars for the part alone, so that doesnt sound so appealing. So i been thinking about swapping in a 6MT STI tranny nowish. I know that the 6MT will mate up to the EJ22 but what i dont know is how easily my old legacy will accept that beast of a transmission. So i was wondering, does anyone know what would go into a swap like this??

any info would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks ahead of time,
Brian

[StatGSR]

the tranny will fit right in, u will need a matching rear diff to match its gear ratio, as well as STi axle stubs. also u will have to switch to a hydrolic cluch set up vs the cable u have in the car, so u just need a master and slave cylinder, and the line to connect em. but yea expect it to be around 4000 dollars more than a couple hundred....

[sheepdog]

It's a bit more complicated than swapping in another 5 speed. The 6 speed has the dccd, which you need to wire in, so usually its best to do that in conjunction with a motor swap. I'm unsure if you can use it without the dccd (ie swap just the trans and wire in the dccd when you swap motors).

Also, you'll need to swap out your rear diff. I'm not sure about axles, but I'm pretty sure what Stat said is right. You'll want to upgrade your brakes if you're going to a turbo motor as well.

Air ride suspension = weight and problems. If you're going to do a turbo build/6 speed, don't ruin it by making the car handle crappy and heavy. Go for a nice set of adjustable coilovers or something. For the amount of money you'd spend to get air ride to work on an awd/subaru platform, you could get a set of Tein Flex's with EDFC, as well as tons of other worthwhile suspension mods.

In terms of the motor, your life will be a lot easier if you go with an STi motor along with the 6 speed. That way, you only have two harnesses to splice together, instead of three. I'd also reccomend going with a US market motor, especially if you're going to be working at a subaru dealer, so you can get parts cheaply and easily when you break them.

[ProdriveDreams]

awesome! ooo trust me, im all too aware about the cost, i'd just rather put that couple hundred towards a new transmission rather than waste anymore time on this 5MT with 192,000 miles on it.

I was just cruising around EBAY and apparently the DCCD has a seperate computer so i could snag one of those and it SHOULD work alright, ill have to investigate that a little further.

Good points on the suspension, the air ride is still just an idea so nothing is definite, i'll be doing a lot more suspension research when the time comes.

will the drive shaft i have now do the job between the new tranny, and rear diff?

[sheepdog]

Yep. You have to use it actually, the STi one will be the wrong length. Also, read the sticky at the top of this thread for some insight on motor swaps.

[Wiscon_Mark]

awesome! ooo trust me, im all too aware about the cost, i'd just rather put that couple hundred towards a new transmission rather than waste anymore time on this 5MT with 192,000 miles on it.

You mean couple thousand, right?

[sheepdog]

I think he means he'd rather put the couple hundred he'd spend repairing this one towards the couple thousand he'd spend to put in the 6 speed.

[StatGSR]

u can run with out a dccd, it just goes into the 30/70 torque split or whatever, my buddy dan put one in his 93 with no dccd yet, and its just stuck in uber rear biased mode with out it.

also i forgot to mention that u will also need a new driveshaft from an automatic legacy, because the 6-speed is the same length as the automatic. u could also just consider getting a ppg gear set to throw in your case, which will save u some money.

[Wiscon_Mark]

On an N/A subie, the close gears will help performance, and the tranny is ultra smooth. While PPGs might be cheaper, the diffs and tranny of the STi are far superior to the old 5MT ones.

If you can do it, I'd say it's worth it.

[ProdriveDreams]

On an N/A subie, the close gears will help performance, and the tranny is ultra smooth. While PPGs might be cheaper, the diffs and tranny of the STi are far superior to the old 5MT ones.

If you can do it, I'd say it's worth it.

My thoughts exactly, besides the PPG gears wont solve my shift fork and syncro woes.

And thanks for that inffo StatGSR, i figured that the 6Spd would be longer than the 5spd and would therefore require a different drive shaft. Man, these subies really are like legos huh?

And i realize that just adding the tranny now will involve a lot of splicing of the wiring harnesses, but i have plenty of practice with a solder gun, and besides, i dont have the money for a new tranny just yet, let alone a whole new block!

[Wiscon_Mark]

...why would you need to mess with wiring for a manual tranny?

[malstew]

The wiring comes from the DCCD (Driver controlled center differential) module. From what I know, the DCCD module is the brains that determines the torque split between the wheels.


Here is an article about it complements of google: http://www.canadiandriver.com/articles/jk/031210.htm

[Wiscon_Mark]

Oh, right, that. I was thinking just the 6spd for some reason.

But integrating the DCCD can't be too terrible, it's a pretty independent system.

[sheepdog]

it talks to your abs though, if i remember right

[Wiscon_Mark]

it talks to your abs though, if i remember right

The DCCD? I know 4EATs do.

[sheepdog]

I think so. Don't quote me though, I've never messed with dccd wiring myself.

[Sarra]

IIRC, if you run DCCD without running an actual STi motor, the "auto" mode on the DCCD doesn't work the same. I do know the DCCD talks to the ECU, and vice-versa.

I think a 6MT coupled with a 6 cylinder would be perfect. An SVX motor (difficult swap) powering the 6MT would probably make your car faster than a stock STi. Gesh, the SVX is faster than a WRX stock vs stock, and that EG33 really pulls from the get-go.

[StatGSR]

^ we gota guy in mn that just put a ej33 in a GC impreza, my guess is that its guna rip.

[Sarra]

^ we gota guy in mn that just put a ej33 in a GC impreza, my guess is that its guna rip.

No kidding. I would love to stuff an EG33 and a turbo into my BK, but I don't think I have the coin for that.

[StatGSR]

haha yea
https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2007/03/myswap-1.jpg

[AJM]

Actually the cheapest thing you could probably do is get a replacement 5sp form a u-pull-it Junk yard, but oviously that is alot of work (here you can get transsmissions for $50- $80 from such a place)


However, a 6 speed would totally kick a**.

[ProdriveDreams]

yeah, i thought about going to get another used 5spd at one of those junkyards, but i've been planning on upgrading this car for a while, and the 6spd was one of those "one of these days" mods. since its almost time for a new transmission, i figure very soon is that time. But i thought about trying to find a wrecked STI in one of those junkyards.... a long shot i know, but worth a try.

[sheepdog]

I got my donor car through Millennium Auto, in Detroit. They get STi's and wrx's fairly often. Number is 586-615-7455

[theboyo19]

^ we gota guy in mn that just put a ej33 in a GC impreza, my guess is that its guna rip.

theres an svx in a junkyard by me .... hmmm..... ill have to see whats left on it :twisted: anyone know if it would fit in a 95 lsi....i think itd be too much trouble to do

[Wiscon_Mark]

EG33 is not going to phsyically fit in your legacy because of the engine block dimensions. You can modify the radiator to create some forward room, but it's still going to be a pain, and throw off the weight distribution some.

[Piddster]

You also need a 6MT specific tranny mount.


The only way you can get the factory DCCD to work is to have the STi ECU and give it enough inputs to make it happy enough to alow the DCCD computer to run. Not worth it IMO. The are a couple aftermarket DCCD controllers though.


I like the 6 speed so far, but the ratios could be a bit better. The Newer ones, '06 or '07?, have revised ratios and a 59/41 torque split as opposed to the 65/35. The shifting is butter compared to the 5mt.


http://www.d.umn.edu/~pidd0002/build%20pics/6mtwstub.jpg

http://www.d.umn.edu/~pidd0002/build%20pics/stubs2.jpg

http://www.d.umn.edu/~pidd0002/build%20pics/transin.jpg

https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2007/06/5mtvs6mt-1.jpg

[ProdriveDreams]

So, im lookin at a JDM 6spd, and just wanted to check before doing something stupid, are htere any notable differences between the JDM and the USDM 6spd model?

[Wiscon_Mark]

I believe GatorGT broke down the differences somewhere...

I can't find it though.

[ProdriveDreams]

hmm, i cant find it either! if someone could list off what differences they know i would be forever greatful!

well, i guess ill keep looking for now...

[Kraziken]

So, im lookin at a JDM 6spd, and just wanted to check before doing something stupid, are htere any notable differences between the JDM and the USDM 6spd model?

The 5th and 6th gear are lower ratio in the JDM version. I have it in my car. Acceleration is a bit better with the lower ratios.

[ProdriveDreams]

UPDATE:

Just bought a JDM 6MT with a Suretrac front LSD and DCCD. also comes with clutch flywheel pressure plate and shifter with linkages (no shift knob) shipping from canada for $3K

Ordered a master clutch cylinder, axle stubs, and an automatic legacy driveshaft from a junkyard and my local subaru dealership.

everything should be arriving within a week or two.

probably gonna order the neetronics DCCD controller.

post more when it arrives!

very very excited...

[ProdriveDreams]

Soooo, my transmission has been sitting in US customs from canada for 10 days now, but I now have all the mounts pedal assembelies, master and slave cylinders that i need and all the TIC and kartboy shifter bushing upgrades that exist including tranny crossmember bushings. Looking at putting the hydraulic pedal and master cylinder in, and realized that my firewall has no holes for it despite there being a cutout int he carpet for one.

SO if someone could please post a shot of the pedal assembely and master clutch cylinder from both sides of the firewall out of a preferably similar model legacy i would greatly appreciate it so i can get cutting!

Many thanks,
Brian

[Piddster]

OK, I tried to take pics, but there's so much in the way that pics wouldn't be of any use to you.


What I'd do, is get the pedal assembly mounted w/out drilling/cutting in your holes. You can use that as a template to cut your holes off of.

Does it at least have the flat spots in the sheet metal where the holes would be? I would think that they'd be there.

[ProdriveDreams]

Quite alright, i managed to figure it out once the whole assembely came.

Yeah, the flat spot is there, The pedal assembely has the bolts welded to it or i would use that as a template, What i did was used the Rubber piece of the cutout int he carpeting where the holes should be because it is the same shape as the mount side of the mastercylinder and then i cut holes in that to match essentially making a makeshift template.

Transmission FINALLY left customs will arrive on monday. Drilling the firewall tomorrow morning, and mounting the pedal assembely so when it arrives i will be pretty much ready to go!

Piddster: Did your pedal assembely have a third hole in the bracket that has the bolts for the master cylinder? and if so did you have anything to mount it too? because my car has nothing for that to bolt to, i imagine it should be fine, i just worry about it flexing.

[Piddster]

Not too shure what you're reffering to at the moment. Maybe cause its 3:39am. Do you have a pic? Mine just bolted in. But if was from a turbo legacy going into another BC.