Strange clutch problems?

[d1giPhux]

So this morning i went to drive the car out of the driveway.. and the clutch felt horrible. In fact.. i couldnt even get it into gear for some time. Eventually i did get it into gear (reverse)..but almost pulled my arm muscle doing it! I checked the tranny fluid.. and it was up to the full line. Driving down the road was the same way.. SUPER hard to shift into any gear.. except for 3rd.. and i think that was because it was the middle top gear you shift into.. which made it seem like it was easier. After driving for about 10 minutes.. i started to think that maybe the pedal on the floor was causing it.. by not completely engaging the clutch.. not sure if thats what did it or not? A few minutes after running.. it seemed to shift into all the gears fine. Strange thing is.. i had no problems with it yesterday at all. The only other time ive felt it be this hard to shift into gears was when it was like -20 degrees outside.

So.. basically what im wondering is.. what COULD be the problem? Could it be that the clutch pedal is not engaging it all the way? I think this could be a possibility, as my clutch pedal wont even return properly for some time now.. but i thought this may have just been the return spring.

or.. is it time for a new clutch. I'm hoping not.. because that would be an expensive mess for me.. because there is no way i can do the work myself.. and really dont know anyone who could help me (although that would be cool).

So.. basically just asking for opinions / ideas as to what it may be. Today when i get out of work.. i will see how its acting.. and hopefully its not all hard to shift again.

This is on a 99 LGT Ltd. BTW. Thanks!

:cry:

[warrior]

Could it be that the clutch pedal is not engaging it all the way? I think this could be a possibility, as my clutch pedal wont even return properly for some time now.. but i thought this may have just been the return spring.

This happens to me.. when I first bought the car, the clutch pedal wouldn't return. I had to get down and pump it with my hand. Then it happened again when the car sat for 3 days while I was away.

The slave cylinder that sits on top of the tranny.. that is what returns the clutch pedal and what engages the clutch in the transmission. There is no spring, it's hydraulic.

You most likely need that replaced, a quick fix is to get some grease and lube the piston that pushes the fork inside the tranny. I did that and it's been working good for a while.. I'll be replacing it soon though.

[kkushner4474]

had same problem with the pedal not returning but worse

this fixed it for me
http://www.sl-i.net/FORUM/viewtopic.php?t=3404

first check fluid for the clutch
then slave cylinder
if that dosent fix it than master

slave first cuz its cheaper

[d1giPhux]

Cool.. so that takes care of the clutch pedal problems then.. but any reason WHY my car would not be shifting into gears easily.. i mean, it was REALLY hard to get it into any gear this morning.. then after driving it for a few minutes.. it seemed fine? Didnt really make any sense to me.. im sort of hoping it will just go away and never come back! :lol:

I dont really know if it had to do with the clutch pedal not pushing in all the way.. maybe.. but even when i DID push the pedal all the way in when it was not shifting into gear.. it still didnt seem to fix it. Strange problems.. hope it wont cost me a fortune.

I will need to read up more about the slave cylinder.. cause i dont know ANYTHING about it. Thanks!

[Wiscon_Mark]

Well, if the clutch wasn't disengaging fully, I can see where it would be hard to force it into gear.

[d1giPhux]

Well, if the clutch wasn't disengaging fully, I can see where it would be hard to force it into gear.

yes.. this is what i meant. i dont think its disengaging completely.. or not engaging fully either.. im not sure which is it? Its just having one hell of a time going into gear. Went out and check it a little while ago.. seems to be working fine now? Sounds like i might need to get the slave replaced like noted.

[jeremod]

The reason it probably started working is because you had pumped the clutch enough times to build up hydraulic pressure again. If you have a slow leak in the system the pressure will bleed off over time like sitting over night.

If you've ever driven a car with a leaking wheel cylinder or caliper you need to pump the brakes a few times before the car will stop.

You might look for fluid leaks on the slave and master cylinders and along the clutch line too.

[d1giPhux]

If it was leaking.. wouldnt i notice it in the reservoir though?

Alright.. more details as to what its doing :

This morning while driving it.. same problem. I go to start the car up.. wont go into reverse.. or any other gears for that matter..

I turn the car off, and it shifts into the gears fine?

So basically, thats how i got it going at first.. shut the car off, shift into gear, turn the car back on.. then after it was warmed up.. seemed like it didnt have any trouble shifting into gears.

With this new info.. anymore guesses as to what it may be? Still the slave cylinder? Why would cutting the power help? Thanks!

[backpack09]

That makes it sound even more hydraulic.

When the car is off. the Syncros are free to align as they would like, with no extra rotation coming from the clutch.

When the car is running, if the clutch is spinning even a little bit because it is dragging (due to poor hydraulics, or a need for adjustment at the pedal) then it is a lot harder for the syncros to mesh with the gears.

Try bleeding your clutch first. That is the cheapest fix. Don't just throw parts at the car, or you will spend alot and may not fix the problem.

A leaking slave will usually leak clutch fluid into the dust boot near the plunger, pop it off and look for brake fluid.

A leaking master will do the same, but usually leave a puddle on the floor in your car.

[d1giPhux]

That makes it sound even more hydraulic.

When the car is off. the Syncros are free to align as they would like, with no extra rotation coming from the clutch.

When the car is running, if the clutch is spinning even a little bit because it is dragging (due to poor hydraulics, or a need for adjustment at the pedal) then it is a lot harder for the syncros to mesh with the gears.

Try bleeding your clutch first. That is the cheapest fix. Don't just throw parts at the car, or you will spend alot and may not fix the problem.

A leaking slave will usually leak clutch fluid into the dust boot near the plunger, pop it off and look for brake fluid.

A leaking master will do the same, but usually leave a puddle on the floor in your car.

Another strange sign.. once ive dealt with turning on the car and getting into all the gears once in the day.. the rest of the day it seems to work fine. Im going to have subaru check it out on monday.. i really think its the slave.. because the pedal has no been returning for some time now.. and this is probably just the end of the problem finally showing itself completely. I wish i had the resources to fix this myself.. but bleeding things.. i dont like doing. I'm not sure why.. it just always sketches me out a bit. Plus.. i just dont really have anywhere TO do it.. and its still to cold out =[

[backpack09]

That is not a strange sign... Those were warning signs that you are leaking clutch fluid...

Use your driveway :) Its 65 out today..

You have the manual. Check out the swap. Since you already have the torque box out. It is literally 2 bolts and 1 banjo bolt. I can't understand taking it to a shop for such a simple job, especcially the stealership.

And for bleeding, crack the bleeder loose. Put a piece of hose off nipple into a bucket. Fill the reservoir. Pump the clutch pedal 5 times. Refill reservoir. Repeat untill the fluid going into your bucket is clean. Tighten the bleeder, top off the reservoir and your done.... literally a 30 minute job, total.

[d1giPhux]

In the manual, is it called an 'operating cylinder'.. urgh.. it looks easy, i just dont wanna mess anything up really.. because i need the car to drive to work everyday.. and dont have a back up. Hmm, it does seem quite easy though. I never saw any leaking liquids however. And what do you mean by i already have the torq box out?

[d1giPhux]

Okay.. so i pulled the boot off the slave cylinder.. and i dont see any liquid or anything? What might that mean? Also the reservoir still seems to be full.. so i dont think its leaking liquids of any kind. Looks like it would be a pretty easy install however. Is the bleed valve on it where the liquid would be drained from? I could probably just use my brake fluid hose for that.. doesnt look to hard at all. Only thing im worried about is that its NOT the slave cylinder. However.. my pedal is not returning.. so it really makes me wonder. I suppose i could bit the bullet and buy the $80 part just to see. Maybe i can lube the slave cylinder a bit to see if it helps anything.. if i do.. what type of grease should i use?

[backpack09]

Okay.. so i pulled the boot off the slave cylinder.. and i dont see any liquid or anything? What might that mean? Also the reservoir still seems to be full.. so i dont think its leaking liquids of any kind. Looks like it would be a pretty easy install however. Is the bleed valve on it where the liquid would be drained from? I could probably just use my brake fluid hose for that.. doesnt look to hard at all. Only thing im worried about is that its NOT the slave cylinder. However.. my pedal is not returning.. so it really makes me wonder. I suppose i could bit the bullet and buy the $80 part just to see. Maybe i can lube the slave cylinder a bit to see if it helps anything.. if i do.. what type of grease should i use?

What color is your fluid in the reservoir? If it has never been replaced, the line proabably has air in it and needs to be bled.

Try Just bleading it (from the bleed valve on it) before replacing it. The clutch hydraulics use brake fluid, and bleed almost the same way as your brakes.

That is the slave cylinder. The master is pushed by the pedal. the Slave pushes the clutch fork... The "master" makes the "slave" work

Oh, and the "torque box" is that black box off the TB that you removed to install your ebay intake.

[d1giPhux]

Okay.. so i pulled the boot off the slave cylinder.. and i dont see any liquid or anything? What might that mean? Also the reservoir still seems to be full.. so i dont think its leaking liquids of any kind. Looks like it would be a pretty easy install however. Is the bleed valve on it where the liquid would be drained from? I could probably just use my brake fluid hose for that.. doesnt look to hard at all. Only thing im worried about is that its NOT the slave cylinder. However.. my pedal is not returning.. so it really makes me wonder. I suppose i could bit the bullet and buy the $80 part just to see. Maybe i can lube the slave cylinder a bit to see if it helps anything.. if i do.. what type of grease should i use?

What color is your fluid in the reservoir? If it has never been replaced, the line proabably has air in it and needs to be bled.

Try Just bleading it (from the bleed valve on it) before replacing it. The clutch hydraulics use brake fluid, and bleed almost the same way as your brakes.

That is the slave cylinder. The master is pushed by the pedal. the Slave pushes the clutch fork... The "master" makes the "slave" work

Oh, and the "torque box" is that black box off the TB that you removed to install your ebay intake.

Is it dot 3 brake fluid that i should use? To bleed the system, all i need to do is put a nipple on the valve stem correct, and then press on the clutch / fill the reservoir at the same time? How would dirty fluid affect this? I wonder if it would fix the problem with my pedal returning as well. I have a 1 way valve hose that i use to bleed brakes with, i think this will work good for doing the slave cylinder as well. I might give this a try tommorow and see if i can bleed out all the bad fluid. I hope that it fixes the problem.. otherwise i really dont know what it could be. If the slave is bad.. wouldnt it be leaking? Same with the master right? Neither are leaking it seems. Also, if i want to grease the slave, what type of grease should i use.. i may clean it / regrease it tommorow as well. Thanks for the help!

[Wiscon_Mark]

Yeah, DOT 3 brake fluid is the one you'd want.

[d1giPhux]

okay.. now i must have fucked something up.. im an idiot. I went to bleed the fluid.. but now my pedal is ALL the way to the floor.. and i dont seem to be getting any liquid from the nipple. Can someone walk me through this.. i know it seems very stupid! =[

i guess what im really trying to ask is.. which friggin nipple was i supposed to loosen.. because i might have done the wrong one.. hence my pedal going dead!

[Reason]

Maybe you should have asked before you did it lol. I never played with it on a Subaru. I would try filling it by the filler bolt (if it has one) and pump the pedal, and keep filling and go back and forth till you get something.

[StatGSR]

man i sure hope any of the info i gave u turns out usefull.... or else im guna have to get uber wasted to feel better about myself... :grin:

[d1giPhux]

haha..im wanting to get uber wasted right about now.. i wish i never touched it. i did read about it.. and yea, its not as simple as they would like you to think. maybe if i had a vaccume bleeding system or something.. but at this point.. i dont know WHAT to do. i cant get any liquid to come out.. the master reservoir level is not going down.. yea.. i dunno.. this sucks. now its going to cost me towing + subaru stealership to get it fixed =[ not cool. really does not help my confidence in wanting to work on my car anymore. thanks for the help tho!

[Wiscon_Mark]

Dude, keep the faith man, if you can still work on the car, follow the lines and see what's up - it's not too hard! You can do it, I know you can.

[d1giPhux]

I've been trying to 6 hours.. i really have no clue what the problem is. Its like.. its not even sucking the liquid from the master through the slave. I watch the slave.. and when you press / pull the clutch pedal in and out.. you can see the little hydraulic (sp?) piece moving.. but other than that.. its not sucking any liquid from the master. When i bleed it.. it will push air out of the tube.. but its too time consuming to press the pedal, let it bleed, pull the pedal... i swear ive done it like 500 times. I just dont even know what to do now. i wish i had a vaccume bleeding system.. because other than that.. i dont know what would work. Liquid was coming out of it a little bit earlier.. but now nothing is coming out of it.. and i cant seem to fix it. Maybe one of those hand pump quick bleeder systems would work? I'm just trying to spend as minimal amount of $ as i can at this point.. because im starting to think its going to need to be towed / delivered to the stealership on monday when i made the appointment for. hmm. i tried a bunch today.. just dont seem to be working for me.