2000 outback w/ trans issues *BOUGHT W/ PICS* shipping out. [Archive]

green97gt

10-14-2009, 09:23 AM

hey fellas, im going to look at a 2000 outback w/ 150K motor runs but seller says you shift it into gear and "it just goes clunk"

i wonder what the problem is...

is this generation of legacy/outback similer to the previous in that a wide range of transmissions will work?

how do i identify the final drive ratio so i can hunt for a trans that matches?

im excited.

anothernord

10-14-2009, 06:05 PM

Bdubs

10-15-2009, 03:31 PM

See if you can find one from an 00-04 OB or LegacyGT, sensors change, wiring changes, it'll make it somewhat easier to stay within your gen. Also, base models didn't come with an LSD, so the Final Drive is different.
Not sure if it's common problem, but my girlfriend's friend has an 00 OB with similar mileage, and her transmission is failing as well.

Airgne

10-15-2009, 03:54 PM

Yep, the engine is just a SOHC 2.5L so basically any subaru transmission made after 1990 will fit.

To find the final drive ratio, just look under the car at the rear diff; it should have a sticker on it or something. If not, find the trans code, which should be on the bell housing, and google it.

00-04 legacies normaly dont have the final drive on a sticker.

there is a code on the side of the tranny that you can look up, and it will tell you your final drive. just make it a maual. the motors in the 00-04 legacies are known to blow heads gaskets.

green97gt

10-15-2009, 04:13 PM

went and checked it out, interior is great, motor runs like a top...

transmission makes an ungoddly metal clunk/snap every 3 feet of car movement...i never got it above 7 or 8 MPH so i couldnt tell if it was gear related.

i said no to his original price, but he JUST called me and cut that price in half...so im heading up there in an hour or so and gonna get it, i just gotta find a tow truck....

anyone know where to find a matching trans for cheap?

Huffer

10-15-2009, 04:25 PM

Throw it up on jackstands and see if the wheels turn... it could be a simple fix like a seized ebrake or snapped axle.

green97gt

10-15-2009, 05:01 PM

im hoping it will be something that simple.... but this is a pretty harsh noise, sounds almost like its coming from the front diff/ right behind the motor...

maybe i can get lucky and its a majorly Fd up TQ converter.

but i doubt it.

green97gt

10-15-2009, 06:36 PM

well, it is safely in my back yard

a 2000 subaru outback with 170k and a helluva clunk out of the transmission, i will try to get videos of it driving soon, here are some pics .

you can see the drivers door is a bit discolored, kind of yellowed..odd.
and the drivers side fender has some dings.
http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs274.snc1/10134_1159028498987_1326025800_30475780_2768172_n.jpg

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs274.snc1/10134_1159028538988_1326025800_30475781_2879715_n.jpg

http://photos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs274.snc1/10134_1159028578989_1326025800_30475782_2209480_n.jpg

you can see in this one under the outback logo there is some crinkling, and a tiny bit of rust around that bar, and the bar is also very loose..
http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs274.snc1/10134_1159028618990_1326025800_30475783_7962965_n.jpg

whaddaya think?

not bad for $400 i dont think.

Bdubs

10-15-2009, 07:57 PM

Considering it looks like it went to hell and back, not all that bad for $400.

green97gt

10-15-2009, 08:16 PM

i dont think it looks THAT bad.......

it has some dings, but is terribly dirty.

it will look better in matte black i think...

impreza_GC8

10-15-2009, 08:24 PM

Wow! $400! You could clean it up, put a good trans in it and turn a MAJOR profit with that car.

hallowpoint

10-15-2009, 10:01 PM

great deal, clean it up and sell or keep and drive, i cant believe 400 bucks

1996Battlewagon

10-15-2009, 10:58 PM

i dont think it looks THAT bad.......

it has some dings, but is terribly dirty.

it will look better in matte black i think...

It doesn't look bad at all! It looks about the same as jg09's did when it was running. :razz:

That was a hella deal man! Looks like it might already have tints. Once you get that trans/axle trouble taken care of, drive the sucker!

green97gt

10-17-2009, 09:59 AM

4n70n1n0

10-17-2009, 10:18 PM

oooo weld the center diff and remove the front axles - rwd fun

k nuff of that

insane deal 4 400 bux dude. Slap a new tranny, ignore me, and drive her till she roats :smt023

green97gt

10-17-2009, 10:35 PM

i had thought about removing the front axles and seeing what happened. im after a new trans anyway, and whats the worst that could happen....screw up the tranny? oh darn.....

i wonder if i could just remove the front axles and run 12V to the solenoid that controls the AWD clutch pack(dont remember whats its called right now) and have some form of RWD< but then would it still be only 50%?

probably burn them up pretty quickly....

1-3-2-4

10-18-2009, 07:56 AM

found out the problem is front diff related.

had the woman drive it and i walked beside it and you could actually SEE the front wheels snap and shuddrr in time with the clunking.

EDIT: there is also a whirring noise when you put it in gear and hold the brake, must be a bearing on the input shaft, or the trans oil pump

trans fluid is dark brown

the Diff dipstick is FuLL of metal!

shopping for new low mileage trans now.

haha chipped ring gear? I had that with my 03 Forester XS the front diff seal was leaking and got low on the highway long story short it popped and cracked the trans case that houses the front diff.

rougeben83

10-18-2009, 03:56 PM

manual conversion? :grin:

green97gt

10-18-2009, 07:29 PM

cleaned the garage and moved the outback into the garage, trying to find my jack stands......

hopefully i can lift the rear wheels high enough to get my wheel ramps under them..i dunno...

ive got railroad ties so i can hillbilly engineer something.

greenspeed

10-19-2009, 01:05 PM

idk how close you are to alaska but up here you can't touch that car running for less than 6k it seems.

1-3-2-4

10-19-2009, 01:15 PM

^ i was in the same boat.. until a member here told me to check CL that night or the very next day I saw my current car listed for $400 I thought it was too good to be true since most people rip off around the tri-state area.

I was almost ready to go with a BH

green97gt

10-19-2009, 04:40 PM

so there are two stickers on the bell housing

one reads:

TZ1A4ZCABA-WL

the other:

948978

am i correct in assuming that i need to find a trans with matching stickers?

OR...?

green97gt

10-19-2009, 06:26 PM

so as i was dinking around under the hood i noticed something odd....

two very thin gauge wires one attached to the battery ground terminal, and one clipped/spliced into the solid blue wire on the ignition coil.

they both run into that rubber grommet thing on the firewall...

then when i look under the dash there is another of the small wires clipped into the white with black stripe wire on the brake switch.

then i looked further and found MORE of those clip on connectors that bite into the wire on the thicker yellow and white wires under the steering wheel....

then i noticed an on/off switch.....

then i noticed a momentary push button switch....

then i noticed a 10 amp and a 3 amp fuse dangling under there

then i noticed a pack of 5 or 6 relays electrical taped together that didn't look like it was supposed to be there, i traced the thicker red wires back to the clips on the yellow/ white wires

then i noticed it....a control unit that also didn't look like it belonged. on the face was written VALET 551R

i googled valet 551R and found that it is a remote start unit.

what are the odds that the wires under the hood, on the ignition coil, and the brake switch are tied into the remote start?

it all makes "sense" ive seen some odd remote start installs... except for the momentary push button switch....what is that for?

EDIT: WTF w/ the DINK smiley..hahah

EDITX2: the momentary pushbutton switch is used in enabling/disabling "valet mode"

i wonder if i bought, and programed a remote if this thing still works....

1-3-2-4

10-19-2009, 06:52 PM

lol sounds like me.. I found lots of those under my dash I had some type of Omega type alarm system.. I got so carried away I had no clue my car has a factory installed Lojack system.

I happen to see the install guide and when it was installed.

Whoever had this car and the past two owners did a good job of not throwing out anything.. I found out my car brand new came from Norwood Subaru haha

rougeben83

10-20-2009, 03:36 AM

so there are two stickers on the bell housing

one reads:

TZ1A4ZCABA-WL

the other:

948978

am i correct in assuming that i need to find a trans with matching stickers?

OR...?

you can look up the first code to see the final drive of your transmission. You just need a replacement transmission that has the same FD to match your current diff. OR buy a transmission with a matching rear diff included. Going price for regular r160 rears around $100-200...

green97gt

10-20-2009, 10:12 AM

where would i look that up?

EDIT:

i did some looking and found that outback trans have a 4.44 final drive ratio.

i was however not able to attach that TZ1****** number to a final drive.

i CAN find trans from different year outbacks with different TZ1******* numbers, and i would ASSUME that outbacks still have the 4.44 FD ratio...

but i sont want to buy a ttrans on a guess.

green97gt

10-20-2009, 11:36 AM

so while i was out there removing the front CV axles i noticed that the front "sway bar" that goes from control arm to control arm is broken and missing. just on the passenger side it sticks out about 1 inch from where it has the rubber bushing bolted to the body and from there to where it meets the control arm is all missing.

what does this adversly effect? it will have more body roll on turns? or? not a HUGE issue in the scheme of things..but it will need replaced.

anybody got an extra they want to part with?

Huffer

10-20-2009, 11:50 AM

what does this adversly effect? it will have more body roll on turns?

That's about it. The front end will feel "floaty".

green97gt

10-20-2009, 12:43 PM

thanks huffer. thats something we can handle after the trans issues are worked out...as long as it wont make the wheels fall of or the car explode :lol:

so i found this

CABA - 199906-200006 2.5 SUSLTD + OBK Part 31000AD800R1
CCBA - 200007-200104 2.5 SUSLTD + OBK + OBKCW + OBKLTD
CDBA - 200105-200204 2.5 SUS + OBK
CFAC - 04 - 2.5 SUS + OBK + Baja

those first four letters are in reference to the last four on the TZ1A4Z**** sticker on the trans.

i have the CABA but all i can find for replacements are the CCBA and CDBA and CFAC

how sure is anyone that these trans will bolt up and work correctly AND have the right final drive ratio.

Ive called suby dealers and given them the correct part number for the transmissions in question(example 3100AD800)
but apparently they do not have access to final drive info...wtf. if they dont who does.

one thing that was made clear is to stay away from the transmissions from the H6 outbacks because they have something called VDC which apparently is incompatible.

but bottom line, i cant find a trans from a 2000 outback, but can find them from an o1, an 02 and i think an 03.

will they work?

i dont want to spend 5 or 6 hundred on a paperweight.

thanks for all the help/info guys.

dodik

10-20-2009, 02:47 PM

did you download the full service manual yet it has good amount of info in it not sure if it has what you are looking for but i think i can email it to you its pdf. if you need it pm me your email and ill send it when i get home.

green97gt

10-20-2009, 04:20 PM

so...

CV axles are out.
exhaust is off
starter is out
alternator is out
heat shields are off.
connectors are apart
pitch stop is off

now my questions are.

what is the proper way to remove the drive shaft? ive never taken one on a subaru out, and i think its two piece... so do i just remove those four bolts by the diff and then take the middle mount thing down, then it will slide out of the trans?

how do i get to the TQ converter bolts? theres a whole bunch more crap under the manifold. when we did the SVX

we used several extensions and went from the front where the alternator was and under the manifold to the TQ converter bolts. do you do this the same way on this outback?

thanks.

ouch1011

10-23-2009, 01:12 AM

Yes, that is how you remove the driveshaft. The carrier bearing is just there mainly so that they can make the driveshaft a smaller diameter. The longer the individual shafts are, the larger diameter they have to be. So, if they can split it in half with a carrier bearing, they can make the shaft smaller diameter. BTW you should drain the trans fluid first, because it will dump out when you remove the driveshaft if you don't.

I believe when I removed the TC bolts I used a u-joint and an extension. Either that or just a deep socket on a ratchet w/no extensions. I usually try to use as few extensions as possible because more extensions make it more likely that the socket will slip off the bolt/nut and you'll end up busting your knuckles. I do that enough as is lol.

green97gt

10-23-2009, 04:23 PM

so the only trans I have been able to find with matching 4.44 gears is from a 2001 outback w/ 34k on it....in SOUTH DAKOTA

waiting on a shipping quote to central Fl :lol:

all the dealerships parts departments are idiots around here.

With the Subaru 3100***** part number AND the TZ1******** trans number AND the last 8 of the VIN
have told me that they "don't have access to" or "the system doesn't tell them" the final drive ratios for the transmissions.

Finally i called a dealership in Loveland Colorado, Davidson Subaru and thanks to a wonderful parts associate named Candice, armed with all the info I had given other parts people(idiots) was able to give me the final drive ratio of every single transmission I asked about. and there were several. THANK YOU CANDICE!

This ones for you Candice :smt030 you really went above and beyond. I am also writing a letter to the owner of the dealership explaining how helpful you were.

Yet another reason FL sucks.

I may just fly out to Colorado and visit Davidson Subaru when it is time to buy my next Subaru.

green97gt

10-24-2009, 03:57 PM

green97gt

10-24-2009, 07:31 PM

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs252.snc1/9916_1164386752940_1326025800_30487392_215572_n.jpg

rougeben83

10-24-2009, 08:21 PM

drive shaft is off... TQ converter bolts are off. i had to remove the TB to get at the TQ converter bolts...so i spose i need a new TB gasket... and while removing the TB i removed what i thought was a vacuum hose on the bottom of the TB, and OOPS..coolant comes out.

so what is this coolant filled hose for? to warm the incoming air to the motor?maybe for cold running conditions?

any info about that would be great.

im gonna go check out the FSM now...

Yes it's to warm the throttle plate during subzero temps as the can potentially be stuck with ice. The coolant bypass modification is a popular mod for that- supposedly keeps hot coolant from warming up the air being sucked in by the TB. You also don't really need a new TB gasket. As long as its not ripped or really damaged you can reuse it.

green97gt

10-24-2009, 08:48 PM

yeah, when i took the TB off the gasket stayed on the manifold..if its not screwed up by the time i have to put it back on i wont get a new one..cheap is better..

so far i need a new-used trans.
trans mount
TB gasket (maybe)
pass. side CV axle
alternator belt.

then to see what the CEL was, but im sure thats minor.

anyone have an extra 4.44 outback trans laying around?

green97gt

10-28-2009, 04:30 PM

cracked open the diff today.

the pinion is messed up beyond words...worse than i thought it would be. only has 3 intact teeth.

and the ring gear is...lumpy

http://photos-h.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs072.snc3/13966_1166957737213_1326025800_30493332_2315091_n.jpg

http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs072.snc3/13966_1166957777214_1326025800_30493333_2296977_n.jpg

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/hs052.snc3/13966_1166957817215_1326025800_30493334_836158_n.jpg

those are actually different sides of the pinion..seems like it smashed itself to hell..skipped a tooth or two, then resumed eating itself.

still shopping for trans/diff w/ case

EDIT: and i just noticed in the pic of the ring gear you can see the reflection of all the chunks in the bottom of the case.

ouch1011

10-29-2009, 11:16 PM

Usually when one tooth breaks, it takes out several others because the broken tooth gets stuck in the next tooth and breaks, and again, and again...

green97gt

11-03-2009, 09:52 PM

got a trans on the way. only suitable, verifiable trans i could find was in TX, got it ordered thanks to a comment on subaruoutback.org.

should be here by monday?

:smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026 :smt026

jolllly good sir! :smt030

EDIT: paid a bit to much, but oh well.

BE-Fresh

11-05-2009, 11:50 AM

Good find for $400!! That could be a very fun project :twisted:

. the motors in the 00-04 legacies are known to blow heads gaskets.

I thought that was just Phase I 2.5s?

1-3-2-4

11-05-2009, 11:56 AM

nope that's why subaru made that coolant mix which I can't think of what they called it but it was to somewhat help cure or slowdown a possible HG issue.

green97gt

11-05-2009, 03:07 PM

yeah, i thought it was only the DOHC HGs that are prone to fail. am i wrong? hmm... coolant in this is bright green, no overheating when let idle. well see.

damn trans needs to get here.

green97gt

11-08-2009, 09:57 PM

ok...so this trans reaaaaaaaaallly needs to get here monday.

im expecting it monday or tuesday, but damn im antsy.....

sick of looking at this damn thing in my garage......

lurking, cold and lonely in the dark....

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs106.snc3/15335_1174364522378_1326025800_30513707_1911092_n.jpg

300 posts. woot.

green97gt

11-09-2009, 05:19 PM

new trans!

http://photos-d.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs106.snc3/15335_1174867414950_1326025800_30514589_4909253_n.jpg

i just need to get some buddies or something to get it out of the van....

: :smt026 :smt026

Huffer

11-09-2009, 09:51 PM

nope that's why subaru made that coolant mix which I can't think of what they called it but it was to somewhat help cure or slowdown a possible HG issue.

Subaru Coolant Conditioner.

green97gt

11-13-2009, 10:32 PM

waiting for differential CV seals, TQ converter oil seal, and drive shaft seals. as they are noticeably damaged from some yahoo putting those red shipping plugs in them, and the TQ oil seal just cause i can.

only place i was able to find them all was the dealership. should have them by Wednesday.

then up she goes.

Zakster87

11-21-2009, 11:24 AM

I have my old tranny sitting out in my garage... it works, but has 172k on it. just swapped it out when replaced my engine for one with 2900m on it. :D I'd be willing to part with it... out of a 2000 Legacy GT Limited.

green97gt

11-22-2009, 03:48 PM

hey, thanks for the offer, and ive got family in Washington/Mt pleasant Iowa.

but i already got a trans.

so ive been waiting around to get another set of hands in the garage to lift the trans up and get it bolted in.

it looks like it will be going to my sister as a commuter.

among the other things i know i need, i will need an AC clutch/pulley.
when i bought the car it had no AC belt on it, and when you spin the pulley by hand it makes a helluva sound.

will one from a previous generation work? or do i need to find an 00-04 pulley?
it also looks like i should be able to undo that center bolt and it will come off?
i remember my old nissan was a PITA.

and the other thing i cant find locally is that front sway bar. mine is broken and need a replacement. Anyone buy an aftermarket or something and want to sell the stock one?

thanks.

P.S.

Buy an SVX!

jey

11-23-2009, 05:28 PM

IIRC the A/C compressor clutch is not serviceable, you have to replace the whole compressor.

green97gt

12-18-2009, 07:23 PM

IT IS ALIVE!

put about 80 miles on it. found an odd quarter size spot of diff oil on the ground once i moved it from where i was going.. but that could just be from me getting it all over everything when i overfilled, then drained, then refilled the diff. also a slight smell of hot diff oil, but i dont seem to be losing any. so ill keep an eye on it for now.

charging the AC tonight.

The list:
'00 Subaru outback: $400
tow truck: $70
trans shipped: $950
new CV axle: $80
fluids, oil/diff/trans: $80
Belts/filters/etc: $100
AC compressor: $70
AC condensor: $80
new sway bar+parts: $90
tires/align: $450

TOTAL: $2,370

going in to be painted by my neighbor for FREE. i have to buy the paint, but that shouldnt be to much.

EDIT: now the only thing im missing is the rubber air intake boot that connects the filter housing to the rest of the plastic junk. anyone got one they want to get rid of?

green97gt

12-19-2009, 04:47 PM

at the 90 mile mark my CEL came on. P0420

changed both O2 sensors with OEM style ones, not the solder in type, hopefully its not the cat.

green97gt

01-14-2010, 05:38 PM

https://sl-i.net/FORUM/images/imported/2010/01/photojpgt1263508436-1.jpg

BYE BYE CAR! :smt006 :smt006 :smt006 :smt006 :smt006

shipping out to my sister. gonna miss it just a little. ive decided i need another of this generation at some point.

gonna have to find more Subaru.

dodik

01-15-2010, 10:57 AM

how did you remove the tranny what did you use to get it out and put new one in?

impreza_GC8

01-15-2010, 01:31 PM

Good work!

green97gt

01-15-2010, 03:00 PM

to remove the old transmission, i just jacked up all four corners of the car, put them on jackstands, removed all the essentials, then used my big ole 4 ton "quick lift" jack from sears and a piece of plywood...pretty much any jack with all four wheels being uni-directional casters will work. and since i knew it was junk i wasnt exactly careful about it hitting the ground...i was just careful that i wasnt under it when it did.

and to put it back in i actually got frustrated and removed the hood and used a chain hoist setup i had for pulling motors. hung that from a couple rafters in the garage with a 4X4 spanning the rafters, attached that right where the pitch stop attaches, used that and the jack from underneath to position it into place, a quick shove, and bam. tighten the bolts.

a little redneck thinking can go a long way.

dodik

01-15-2010, 03:06 PM

thanks man ill be doing that in spring time, how much time did it take to disconnect all the stuff around it and drop it if you remember.

green97gt

01-15-2010, 03:34 PM

i would say if i buckled down and just did it, the whole trans would be out laying on the floor in... 2 or 3 hours give or take.

but i stopped for several beer breaks..then work after those always seems to go a little slower. :lol:

but when it comes tome to actually remove the trans i would make sure you have a buddy around, then one lay on the pass. side and one on the drivers side and muscle the thing out and down, but just be really careful if your using a jack(or two) that you never put yourself in a position where the trans could slip/roll onto you or your arms/hands.

theres really not alot to remove.

CV axles
exhaust system(disconnecto2 sensors)
heat shield BS
rear driveshaft(which i found a PITA, just cause the previous owner had used 3 different bolts on the rear diff flange)
two(or 3?) trans elect. connectors
starter(thats debatable)
TB(also debatable)
TQ converter bolts
trans cooler lines
then the last should be rear Xmember and engine/trans bolts

i might have missed something in there, but its all pretty simple and straightforward.

all you really need is a 10MM,12MM,14MM, 17MM,19MM,22MM sockets in both deep and shallow and wrenches.

and of course drain it first.

also, i learned this trick on the SVX, but if you use another jack and piece of wood to jack up the front of the motor it makes it alot easier to remove the old trand, and mate the new one up to the block.

then once your trans is bolted up to the block, jack the tail of the trans up and bolt on your Xmember on and its in, then just go about hooking everything else up.

might also want to consider doing balljoints while your there, cause they have to come most of the way off anyway, and sometimes get damaged.